Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge
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@Reinier007, I have had the same problem with one particular route (home to work, which I have been testing intensively). The app would not "touch" WP5 and continue to WP6, although my track proves that I touched WP5 very nicely:
When manually skipping to 6, the problem moved along to WP6, where is previously skipped 6 normally. I exchanged WP5 with a new one, but that did not help. At one moment I used my second phone simultaneously, and that proved to me that it must be linked to my device. The second phone had no problem "touching" the WP!
This situation has been going wrong for a week or three, and was VERY consistent. This morning however, to my own surprise, the problem had seemed resolved.
I have been linking this to my phone or to a map-error, but since I have not heard of anything like this earlier, I thought it was not meaningful enough for the forum. Of course your identical problem changed that
Are you a beta user?
@Con-Hennekens I also had such problems with my phone. Last week I did a reset of my GPS data and hopefully that will help but could not test is already.
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@Reinier007, I have had the same problem with one particular route (home to work, which I have been testing intensively). The app would not "touch" WP5 and continue to WP6, although my track proves that I touched WP5 very nicely:
When manually skipping to 6, the problem moved along to WP6, where is previously skipped 6 normally. I exchanged WP5 with a new one, but that did not help. At one moment I used my second phone simultaneously, and that proved to me that it must be linked to my device. The second phone had no problem "touching" the WP!
This situation has been going wrong for a week or three, and was VERY consistent. This morning however, to my own surprise, the problem had seemed resolved.
I have been linking this to my phone or to a map-error, but since I have not heard of anything like this earlier, I thought it was not meaningful enough for the forum. Of course your identical problem changed that
Are you a beta user?
@Con-Hennekens said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
This situation has been going wrong for a week or three, and was VERY consistent. This morning however, to my own surprise, the problem had seemed resolved.
I have to come back on this. This morning the problem returned, and my route did not want to "hit" WP 5 again. I have no clue to why this is always WP5. The "hit" is almost perfect today:
But I am thinking about an internet issue now. I see that, when I skip WP5 manually, it takes a lot of time to calculate, and often leads to a switch to offline mode. This however with a FULL strength GSM signal. I also happen to know that there is a GSM antenna in the direct vicinity of where this problem occurs.
I find it strange that "hitting" waypoints would depend on internet access. There is no calculation going on if you hit a WP, is there? (question for @Corjan-Meijerink ) The coming days I will explore if this problem is not showing structurally in offline mode.
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@Reinier007 Interessant, niet echt eerder gehoord van een dergelijk probleem. Intern in de app zijn vormingspunten en viapunten identiek als het gaat omtrent de navigatie zelf. Het enige verschil wat er dan kan zijn tussen de punten is dat de vormingspunten uiteindelijk automatisch worden overgeslagen. Was dat ook zo?
Reed je toevallig in een gebied met slecht bereik? Wat voor type telefoon gebruik je?
@Corjan-Meijerink - Hi Corjan, Nee ik reed niet in een gebied met slecht bereik. Volledig signaal. Zie ook de opmerking van Con Hennekens, internet-verbinding zou niet mogen uitmaken of je een waypoint hebt geraakt of niet. Tijdens navigeren rijd ik er zuiver overheen.
Ik heb een Samsung Galaxy S7. Gebruik ook al jaren de MRA-navigatie-app (vorige versie) en daarmee nooit dit soort problemen gehad. -
@Corjan-Meijerink - Hi Corjan, Nee ik reed niet in een gebied met slecht bereik. Volledig signaal. Zie ook de opmerking van Con Hennekens, internet-verbinding zou niet mogen uitmaken of je een waypoint hebt geraakt of niet. Tijdens navigeren rijd ik er zuiver overheen.
Ik heb een Samsung Galaxy S7. Gebruik ook al jaren de MRA-navigatie-app (vorige versie) en daarmee nooit dit soort problemen gehad.@Reinier007, als je de mogelijkheid hebt, zou het interessant zijn om te proberen of je hetzelfde probleem ervaart met Offline navigatie enabled. Ik heb dezelfde route al tig keer online afgelegd waarbij het probleem zich bijna telkens voordoet, en 3x in offline mode waarbij het probleem zich tot nog toe structureel NIET voordoet. De link met een de internetverbinding wordt daardoor steeds plausibeler, ook als snappen we niet waarom dat zo zou zijn.
Overigens kan het best zo zijn dat je een goed signaal ontvangt, maar op een cruciaal moment zich net een hop van de ene naar de andere mast voordoet waardoor je op dat moment even geen internet hebt. Dat lijkt bij mijn "beruchte" WP5 aan de hand te kunnen zijn, omdat ik daar nagenoeg precies in een triangel van masten rij.
Probleem dat ik heb met mijn eigen theorie
is dat de antenne dichtheid in NL dusdanig hoog is, dat dit een véél meer voorkomend probleem zou moeten zijn. Echter als je een keer een scenic route rijdt en dit gebeurt, dan haal je je schouders op en druk je op skip WP, terwijl als je dit telkens op hetzelfde WP van je woon/werk route ervaart, dan gaat dat opvallen natuurlijk.I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app -
@Reinier007, als je de mogelijkheid hebt, zou het interessant zijn om te proberen of je hetzelfde probleem ervaart met Offline navigatie enabled. Ik heb dezelfde route al tig keer online afgelegd waarbij het probleem zich bijna telkens voordoet, en 3x in offline mode waarbij het probleem zich tot nog toe structureel NIET voordoet. De link met een de internetverbinding wordt daardoor steeds plausibeler, ook als snappen we niet waarom dat zo zou zijn.
Overigens kan het best zo zijn dat je een goed signaal ontvangt, maar op een cruciaal moment zich net een hop van de ene naar de andere mast voordoet waardoor je op dat moment even geen internet hebt. Dat lijkt bij mijn "beruchte" WP5 aan de hand te kunnen zijn, omdat ik daar nagenoeg precies in een triangel van masten rij.
Probleem dat ik heb met mijn eigen theorie
is dat de antenne dichtheid in NL dusdanig hoog is, dat dit een véél meer voorkomend probleem zou moeten zijn. Echter als je een keer een scenic route rijdt en dit gebeurt, dan haal je je schouders op en druk je op skip WP, terwijl als je dit telkens op hetzelfde WP van je woon/werk route ervaart, dan gaat dat opvallen natuurlijk.@Con-Hennekens said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
als je de mogelijkheid hebt, zou het interessant zijn om te proberen of je hetzelfde probleem ervaart met Offline navigatie enabled. Ik heb dezelfde route al tig keer online afgelegd waarbij het probleem zich bijna telkens voordoet, en 3x in offline mode waarbij het probleem zich tot nog toe structureel NIET voordoet. De link met een de internetverbinding wordt daardoor steeds plausibeler, ook als snappen we niet waarom dat zo zou zijn.
Overigens kan het best zo zijn dat je een goed signaal ontvangt, maar op een cruciaal moment zich net een hop van de ene naar de andere mast voordoet waardoor je op dat moment even geen internet hebt. Dat lijkt bij mijn "beruchte" WP5 aan de hand te kunnen zijn, omdat ik daar nagenoeg precies in een triangel van masten rij.Just speculating: Since you mention that there are a number of antennas there, perhaps the problem is TOO MUCH signal and the receiver in your phone is briefly overloaded. (Sorry to respond in English -- I have been following the discussion with the help of Google Translate!
)Vinnie
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@Con-Hennekens said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
als je de mogelijkheid hebt, zou het interessant zijn om te proberen of je hetzelfde probleem ervaart met Offline navigatie enabled. Ik heb dezelfde route al tig keer online afgelegd waarbij het probleem zich bijna telkens voordoet, en 3x in offline mode waarbij het probleem zich tot nog toe structureel NIET voordoet. De link met een de internetverbinding wordt daardoor steeds plausibeler, ook als snappen we niet waarom dat zo zou zijn.
Overigens kan het best zo zijn dat je een goed signaal ontvangt, maar op een cruciaal moment zich net een hop van de ene naar de andere mast voordoet waardoor je op dat moment even geen internet hebt. Dat lijkt bij mijn "beruchte" WP5 aan de hand te kunnen zijn, omdat ik daar nagenoeg precies in een triangel van masten rij.Just speculating: Since you mention that there are a number of antennas there, perhaps the problem is TOO MUCH signal and the receiver in your phone is briefly overloaded. (Sorry to respond in English -- I have been following the discussion with the help of Google Translate!
)Vinnie
@Vincent-Curren, No problem, I am all for English
In theory you make a valid point, however if too much antennas is a problem, that would in MANY occasions be a problem, if you see the GSM coverage in the Netherlands...
Especially in urban areas many people would suffer likewise experiences.
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@Con-Hennekens said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
als je de mogelijkheid hebt, zou het interessant zijn om te proberen of je hetzelfde probleem ervaart met Offline navigatie enabled. Ik heb dezelfde route al tig keer online afgelegd waarbij het probleem zich bijna telkens voordoet, en 3x in offline mode waarbij het probleem zich tot nog toe structureel NIET voordoet. De link met een de internetverbinding wordt daardoor steeds plausibeler, ook als snappen we niet waarom dat zo zou zijn.
Overigens kan het best zo zijn dat je een goed signaal ontvangt, maar op een cruciaal moment zich net een hop van de ene naar de andere mast voordoet waardoor je op dat moment even geen internet hebt. Dat lijkt bij mijn "beruchte" WP5 aan de hand te kunnen zijn, omdat ik daar nagenoeg precies in een triangel van masten rij.Just speculating: Since you mention that there are a number of antennas there, perhaps the problem is TOO MUCH signal and the receiver in your phone is briefly overloaded. (Sorry to respond in English -- I have been following the discussion with the help of Google Translate!
)Vinnie
@Vincent-Curren said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
briefly overloaded
This is very much unlikely. Even if a phone is receiving the GSM TX powers from 10 antenna's the received power is only 10dB higher, assuming an almost impossible uniform power distribution for each tx at that specific location. A 10dB increase in received power is typically far below the IP1dB limit of the receiver, for any real world distances from the TX antennas(i.e., not standing underneath a tx tower).
Even in the case of receiver saturation, the app behaviour should not change, since a receiver saturation is definitely not causing a loss of signal, instead we lose some sensitivity of the receiver, since signal compression occurs and harmonic content and intermodulation products increase, but this is usual business for any receiver and their applications. They deal with that correctly, at least in the hardware/phone software.
All technical aspects aside, I like your thinking. 
Manks bu'j te bange.
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@Vincent-Curren said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
briefly overloaded
This is very much unlikely. Even if a phone is receiving the GSM TX powers from 10 antenna's the received power is only 10dB higher, assuming an almost impossible uniform power distribution for each tx at that specific location. A 10dB increase in received power is typically far below the IP1dB limit of the receiver, for any real world distances from the TX antennas(i.e., not standing underneath a tx tower).
Even in the case of receiver saturation, the app behaviour should not change, since a receiver saturation is definitely not causing a loss of signal, instead we lose some sensitivity of the receiver, since signal compression occurs and harmonic content and intermodulation products increase, but this is usual business for any receiver and their applications. They deal with that correctly, at least in the hardware/phone software.
All technical aspects aside, I like your thinking. @Stefan-Hummelink, you are obviously knowledgeable about this
What do you think about the moment of roaming between towers. Does this lead to a moment of large lag in the internet connection that could pose a problem? For speech transmission obviously no problem, for data that could be very different. Maybe in the app time-out values should be reconsidered, or a second attempt for a calculation if it fails in X ms need to be implemented?I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app -
@Stefan-Hummelink, you are obviously knowledgeable about this
What do you think about the moment of roaming between towers. Does this lead to a moment of large lag in the internet connection that could pose a problem? For speech transmission obviously no problem, for data that could be very different. Maybe in the app time-out values should be reconsidered, or a second attempt for a calculation if it fails in X ms need to be implemented?@Con-Hennekens Well, I'm definitely not into the application side of the hardware, also known as Software muhaha, but the hardware itself really doesn't care about any drop of signal, from "good signal strength" to "almost none".
The issue with a drop of signal should be tackled in the software. The hardware can only do so much, but not solve the issue of having no signal, besides triggering it's BIT signals to the phones software.
Manks bu'j te bange.
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@Con-Hennekens Well, I'm definitely not into the application side of the hardware, also known as Software muhaha, but the hardware itself really doesn't care about any drop of signal, from "good signal strength" to "almost none".
The issue with a drop of signal should be tackled in the software. The hardware can only do so much, but not solve the issue of having no signal, besides triggering it's BIT signals to the phones software.
@Stefan-Hummelink said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
The issue with a drop of signal should be tackled in the software.
Yes of course, but it would be handy for devs to know what they have to tackle in their software
I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app -
@Stefan-Hummelink said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
The issue with a drop of signal should be tackled in the software.
Yes of course, but it would be handy for devs to know what they have to tackle in their software
@Con-Hennekens That's true, but unfortunately I cannot think of something that the hardware produces that helps in tackling this. I think the app talks to the phone software and not directly to the hardware itself, but I'm note sure about that since that is not my cup of tea.
I would perhaps try to get the actual data speed and based on that determine whether to trigger a recalculation. A "no data" report may be based on a hard limit, instead of being a "workable" limit. Not an issue if your going from great speed to bad speed after which the app moves from on- to offline, but the other way around would be a issue for going from off- to online. If the app checks for a "data present" status with the limit of the datarate being too low, the recalculation might not succeed.
Maybe the app should stop trying to recalculate if the datarate is just too low, and stay offline untill the datarate is above a pragmatically determined workable dataspeed.
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@Stefan-Hummelink @Con-Hennekens As someone who has zero knowledge of any of the technical matters that you two are discussing, I find myself becoming slightly aroused with your conversation
Always willing to help if I can.
Triumph Tiger 1200 XRT called Tina.
MRA Navigation Next and SilverFox B8J bar buttons.
Quadlock wireless mount for IPhone 11.
Cardo Scala Packtalk Bold.
TomTom Rider 500. (In the cupboard now) -
Not the only one @Nick-Carthew. This is fascinating @Stefan-Hummelink and @Con-Hennekens, and something I knew nothing about until now.
I know that the Dev Team are looking at testing speed of connection with the offline and online auto action following some feedback that others and I have given. I too have had similar issues to @Con-Hennekens with strong signal areas. Curious where this may end up and the solution. Intriguing thread guys.
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@Stefan-Hummelink @Con-Hennekens As someone who has zero knowledge of any of the technical matters that you two are discussing, I find myself becoming slightly aroused with your conversation
@Nick-Carthew Oh Gosh ... Getting a Brit aroused is way beyond my expectations and certainly not a what I call positive collateral hahahahahaha.
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@Stefan-Hummelink @Con-Hennekens As someone who has zero knowledge of any of the technical matters that you two are discussing, I find myself becoming slightly aroused with your conversation
@Nick-Carthew, I am glad for you that you reach such a state on written words alone
I am the first to admit my knowledge on the subject is rather slim. I am just trying to wrap my head around the problem at hand.@Stefan-Hummelink, yes I am aware that the app itself does not talk directly to the hardware. But if devs want to solve this, they first must know what to solve. In my imagination, while the hardware switches from antenna to antenna, there will be a short moment of "no data" while the signal strength is high. The problem is that switching antennas can happen literally ANY time. implementing an internet connection bandwidth test will NOT prevent the hardware from switching towers, resulting in a short "no data" phase. If we know that, for example, the "no data" phase of such a switch is 20ms, dev could perhaps implement a second calculation event 50ms after the first one fails. Probably enough to overcome a no data phase, and little enough for anyone to notice. All completely hypothetical of course.
@Nick-Carthew, are you okay?
I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app -
@Nick-Carthew, I am glad for you that you reach such a state on written words alone
I am the first to admit my knowledge on the subject is rather slim. I am just trying to wrap my head around the problem at hand.@Stefan-Hummelink, yes I am aware that the app itself does not talk directly to the hardware. But if devs want to solve this, they first must know what to solve. In my imagination, while the hardware switches from antenna to antenna, there will be a short moment of "no data" while the signal strength is high. The problem is that switching antennas can happen literally ANY time. implementing an internet connection bandwidth test will NOT prevent the hardware from switching towers, resulting in a short "no data" phase. If we know that, for example, the "no data" phase of such a switch is 20ms, dev could perhaps implement a second calculation event 50ms after the first one fails. Probably enough to overcome a no data phase, and little enough for anyone to notice. All completely hypothetical of course.
@Nick-Carthew, are you okay?
@Con-Hennekens said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
@Nick-Carthew, are you okay?
I'm lying back now and having a cigarette
Always willing to help if I can.
Triumph Tiger 1200 XRT called Tina.
MRA Navigation Next and SilverFox B8J bar buttons.
Quadlock wireless mount for IPhone 11.
Cardo Scala Packtalk Bold.
TomTom Rider 500. (In the cupboard now) -
@Con-Hennekens said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
@Nick-Carthew, are you okay?
I'm lying back now and having a cigarette
@Nick-Carthew said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
I'm lying back now and having a cigarette
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Today I drove on the A12 near Gouda and saw 2 times that the app was going offline for a moment. Just a few seconds and than it was back again. That’s a problem I’ve never had before. This must be a bug in the MRA-app.
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I experienced the same issue as the OP this week. At first I thought maybe my waypoint was off the road. I knew where I was going so it didn't matter but when I got home and checked the route, the waypoint was on the road.
It also happened at the end of two different routes with my endpoint. I rode through the final waypoint and it kept trying to route me back to it. I am using a Pixel 7 and this happened once on my phone and twice through Android Auto.
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I experienced the same issue as the OP this week. At first I thought maybe my waypoint was off the road. I knew where I was going so it didn't matter but when I got home and checked the route, the waypoint was on the road.
It also happened at the end of two different routes with my endpoint. I rode through the final waypoint and it kept trying to route me back to it. I am using a Pixel 7 and this happened once on my phone and twice through Android Auto.
@Tom-Cat said in Via-punt niet herkend - te kleine marge:
I rode through the final waypoint and it kept trying to route me back to it.
This is by design. If you pass the finish, it will keep calculating to it, in case you need the assistance.
I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app
