Flexibility of Speed Alerts

[Corjan Meijerink]

In countries where it’s not allowed (such as Germany) you can leave it to “all” as we don’t even warn you about the camera’s. We don’t know where they are (as it’s not allowed)

[Axel Härtl]

@Corjan-Meijerink

Hi Corjan,

thanks for your reply.

It might be technical true, that no radar alerts are issued. But why not adjusting those settings, so that they are logical?

Jörgen answered in the German selfservice forum, that the police is not allowed to open a navigation software to check wether the warner is active.

From a strictly legal standpoint, that’s certainly correct. But what’s the atmosphere during a checkpoint, say, in the Harz Mountains? When I watch the relevant YouTube videos, there’s always a certain feeling of tension in the air.

That’s why I’d like to see this issue properly addressed in MRA. So I’ve submitted this proposal for improvement.

I'm pretty sure, that this adjustment in the settings is no rocket science.

Best, Axel

[Corjan Meijerink]

@Axel-Härtl said:

I'm pretty sure, that this adjustment in the settings is no rocket science.

No, definitely not but is that currently a priority?
As said, we don't warn at all for countries where this is not allowed. Therefore there is no real issue.
Moves it down the priority list quite quickly. This setting exists for multiple years and not ever someone requested a change. Not saying it's a bad request but definitely not something that needs be altered immediately.

[Axel Härtl]

@Corjan-Meijerink

OK.

I understand completely, that my request has a low priority. That's ok.

Sometimes miracles occur and those requests were solved even when having a low priority.

Best, Axel

[nomko]

@Corjan-Meijerink said:
As said, we don't warn at all for countries where this is not allowed. Therefore there is no real issue.

Do not agree with this statement. It is a real issue.
For Germany the issue is not that big as @axel-härtl stated:

Jörgen answered in the German selfservice forum, that the police is not allowed to open a navigation software to check wether the warner is active.

But... and this is a big BUT!
In Switzerland it is by law even forbidden to use a system that warns people for speed camera's. But it is by law even forbidden to possess such systems in your car/camper/truck or on your motorbike.

If you are caught with a system that has the possibility to warn you, your device might even be confiscated!

At what way does MRA avoid these limitation? Just saying it is disabled for Switzerland is not enough as it appears. It is still there, maybe not usable, but it is still present on your mobile/in the app.

https://www.bazg.admin.ch/en/radar-detectors-banned-switzerland

[Rob Verhoeff]

@nomko said:

But... and this is a big BUT!
In Switzerland it is by law not even forbidden to use a system that warns people for speed camera's. But it is by law even forbidden to possess such systems in your car/camper/truck or on your motorbike.

There is a contradiction in your statement. I think you mean that it is forbidden by law in Switzerland...
I visit Switzerland several times a year. In the past 40 years, I’ve never once been stopped by the police. Stick to the rules and there isn’t a cop who will pay attention to you. Push your luck? Then keep looking over your shoulder and quickly turn your screen to black when he approaches you.

[nomko]

@Rob-Verhoeff said:

@nomko said:

But... and this is a big BUT!
In Switzerland it is by law not even forbidden to use a system that warns people for speed camera's. But it is by law even forbidden to possess such systems in your car/camper/truck or on your motorbike.

There is a contradiction in your statement. I think you mean that it is forbidden by law in Switzerland...
I visit Switzerland several times a year. In the past 40 years, I’ve never once been stopped by the police. Stick to the rules and there isn’t a cop who will pay attention to you. Push your luck? Then keep looking over your shoulder and quickly turn your screen to black when he approaches you.

I've corrected my statemant, keenly observed

What you're saying is the most heard excuse of everybody visiting Switzerland.

Reason:
Police really don't stop every vehicle just to check if you have such device on board. That will consume too much time and manpower.

Consider yourself lucky, that's it!

Same reason about Luxemburg were some law (have no clue, never saw it) says that you are not allowed to have an external dashcam on your helmet. Many bikers complained about this that they were stopped, got fined and had to remove the cam
.Been in Luxemburg soo many times on my bike with a camera attached to my helmet and i have been passed by so many police cars... Never got stopped. Same reason, time consuming and manpower.

If you ride normally, obtain the speed limit and don't do crazy shit on your bike, you really don't give the law enforcement any reason to stop you.

And you can trust me on this one, the Swiss police really knows that every non-Swiss citizen drives around with navigation/speed camera/speed alert apps. It's just a matter of time consuming and manpower to check foreign vehicle.

[Marinus van Deudekom]

The law forbids you to have devices that detect radar and speed traps. MRA and all the other devices and apps don’t do that.
Sticking to MRA it doesn’t detect radar etc just points out on the map locations that might have the possibility of speedcontrol. In the Netherlands MRA knies a part of the known locations but not all. In Germany MRA doesn’t show any location at all.
In the Netherlands having a device that defects radar étais also structuur fiorbidden and you risk a sévère penalty.
The mentionnes TomTom does nothing else in Zwitserland. It does not désactivante the complete system.
If you encounter a policeofficer don’t be a smartass. Just coöperatie and you’ll be fine. They know MRA and TomTom don’t detect speed devices

[nomko]

@Marinus-van-Deudekom said:

The law forbids you to have devices that detect radar and speed traps. MRA and all the other devices and apps don’t do that.

Not correct:

MRA is beside a navigation app also a driver alert app which is installed on a device (smartphone). Therefore the rule/law applies as well.

But, hey, you're the expert Marinus!!! I'm just a stupid idiot...

[Nick Carthew]

@nomko Does MRA provide speed camera alerts or radar detection in Switzerland?

[Con Hennekens]

@nomko, Yes, MRA can give warnings, but it does not do that in countries were it is not allowed. It is really not that difficult...

[Marinus van Deudekom]

@Con-Hennekens no MRA does not DETECT those installations, just provides the locations of known places where camera's are installed. That is not against the law

[Marinus van Deudekom]

@nomko I don't think your an idiot at at. Just read the message carefully. The one that you posted yourself. Being a retired policeman myself I do know something about reading the law right

[Corjan Meijerink]

Keep it nice....

[Axel Härtl]

Hello everyone,

This thread has unexpectedly turned into a major discussion. I’m not sure if that’s appropriate for the topic.

So I’d like to briefly summarize what we’ve learned. I hope I’ve understood everything correctly.

1: Radar detectors warnings are banned in many countries.
2: Active navigation devices or detectors are therefore not allowed to warn of speed cameras.
3: Even if these warning systems do not trigger alerts in certain countries, they are prohibited in navigation devices.
4: The police are likely familiar with common navigation systems, such as TomTom or MRA, and know that speed camera warnings are possible.
5: During traffic stops, the police are not permitted to actively open navigation devices to check for the presence of radar detectors warnings.
6: It is unclear how this is handled in practice, given the typically tense atmosphere.
7: There is no logical connection between “speed camera warnings” and "alerts regarding local speeding violations".
8: According to Corjan, adapting MRA to separate these two options does not require significant technical effort.
9: Adapting MRA to reflect this change is not a high priority.

I would suggest that we end the discussion here and let @corjan-meijerink decide if and when he implements this proposal.

Agreed?

Best regards ‍️‍

Axel

[Con Hennekens]

Radar detectors are a different kind of thing. Those devices can actively detect radar waves being used by speed traps. This is also unlawful in the Netherlands but certainly NOT a thing the MRA app can do.

Driver alert systems tend to have a list of speedtraps, and warn when you enter such area. This is NOT prohibited in the Netherlands for example, but is in some other countries like Germany and Switzerland it is. Since MRA offers NO speedtrap locations in countries where that is prohibited, MRA is NOT a forbidden navigational app in those counties, since it does not warn for speed traps.

Just to be clear

[Axel Härtl]

@Con-Hennekens OK, let's change the expression to radar warnings.