Bicycle route on Navigation app: how to select bike map?

Martin Middelkoop

Hi
I created a 'rondrit' for bicycle on the MRA website, this works cool.
If you 'use' the track it generates: it creates a rout of out it, which looks good on the MRA website and Myroute app.
If I select it in the Navigation app: it makes a mess out of the routing. Looks like the bicycle paths/map are not aivalable in the Navigation app?
iOS, v1.0.30

Stefan Hummelink

@Martin-Middelkoop Ha Martin,

De MRA navigation app maakt gebruik van de Here kaart.
Routes die je in de MRA Navigation app wilt gebruiken moeten in de routeplanner in de Here kaart gemaakt worden. De geselecteerde overlay (opencycle map bv.) Heeft daar geen invloed op, maar als je OpenStreetMap of TomTom als kaart algoritme hebt geselecteerd wel! Dus alleen als je route in de Here kaart hebt gemaakt, komt deze overeen in navigation app. Ik vermoed dat hier het e.e.a. is mis gegaan.
English: The MRA Navigation app makes use of the Here map algorithm. Routes that are to be used in conjunction with MRA Navigation shall be created in the Here map in the MRA Routeplanner. The map overlays (opencycle map i.e.) don't have any influence on the route calculation and serve as visual aids to the user only. Selecting the OSM or TomTom map for route calculation does have an effect and will most likely introduce discrepancies in MRA Navigation. So only if you've created your route in the Here map, the route will be identical to the route in MRA Routeplanner. Probably this is where it went haywire in your case.

Ben je welwillend je route openbaar te delen hierzo, zodat iemand van ons kan kijken?
English: Are you willing to share your route here? Please set the privacy setting to public.

Zojuist ook even getest en het lijkt er op dat na "Bewerk route-track" de route niet automatisch op "Fietsen" modus komt te staan ook al is die vanuit de rondrit generator voor fietsen gemaakt. Hier kan dus je afwijking zitten! Tevens blijft bovenstaande verder gewoon waar omdat de gemaakte route altijd nog door de fietser gecontroleerd moet worden en dat betekent dus ook dat je checkt of je in de Here kaart aan het werken bent. En of de gemaakte route in de Here kaart wel goed overeen komt met de track waaruit die ontstaan is. Soms moet je wat routepunten bij plaatsen of verschuiven omdat ze op kruispunten of rotondes staan etc.
*English: I just tried it myself and it seems that after "Modify route-track", the driving mode of the route that is created from the track from the roundtour generator, is not automatically set to "Cycling" even if it's origin is the roundtour generator for cycling mode. This may very well be your issue! Even though this seems to be your issue, the user still need to check the entire route and the waypoint placement because sometimes the waypoints are automatically placed into junctions, bridges or roundabout which is a no go. Also you need to make sure that the route is created in the Here map, which might not be the case since the route will be opened with the default map option you've set yourself. Even if all these aspects are okay, and if you really liked the shown "Route-track" from the generator, you'd also need to make sure the route is exactly matching the route-track by showing the route-track underneath the route through the "Routes" sub-menu in the menu bar on the left.

Zie hieronder twee routes, beide gemaakt uit rondrit generator voor fietsen. De 2e in de lijst was de eerste route na "Bewerk Route-track" en die stond dus automatisch op "Rijden" dus zie je motor -auto symbooltjes. Daarna kopie gedraaid van die route en op "Fietsen" gezet, en zie daar het fiets symbooltjes in de navigatie app.
English: See below my two created routes in MRA Navigation both created from the roundtour generator which mode set to cycling. The riding mode of the 2nd route in the list was not modified by me, and it shows that the riding mode is set to "driving" as confirmed by the car/motorcycle symbol in front of the name. The riding mode of 1st route is set to cycling manually by me and it shows a bicycle symbol in front.

Hope this helps!

Nick Carthew

@StefanHummelink English if you can please

Stefan Hummelink

@Nick-Carthew Haha sorry Nick, I saw his name being Dutch or Belgian so I responded in Dutch. Will translate tomorrow 🤭

Nick Carthew

@StefanHummelink No worries. We like members to use English in the main channels so that most can understand

Stefan Hummelink

@Nick-Carthew So Nick, now you can try to learn Dutch! English vs Dutch in my post above. I see opportunities.

Nick Carthew

@StefanHummelink Thanks for the translation. I sometimes feel embarrassed by my European friends ability to speak more than one language.

Stefan Hummelink

@Nick-Carthew don't be! Multilingual education is one of the benefits of living in an country with a non-world language(like Dutch), for lack of a better term ...
In the Netherlands by default we learn German and French since that are the adjacent countries that are not similar to Dutch. Vlaams (Part of Belgium) is similar to Dutch so we can understand eachother already

Funny thing though is that my parents speak German significantly better than I do due to the fact that in the early years of television German TV was far more available than English TV, or at least the presence of English on the TV. English for them is harder than for us young people.

Drabslab

@StefanHummelink we invented our own version of the dutch language; it is called west-flemish and even people from the next village are unabel to understand each other

Stefan Hummelink

@Drabslab Hahahaha, in my local region we sort of have the same thing: Twents Dialect. People on the other side of the river Ijssel, cannot understand us

Martin Middelkoop

Hi Stefan
The link is: https://www.myrouteapp.com/nl/social/route/4604579?mode=share

When switching between Open street map (standard) - in this view the route is OK, take close look at the route between route point 18 and 19. 11 and 12 etc.
When switching to Here: It messes it up. On the iPhone iOS Navigation app: i believe it selects the Here map as standard? Is there a way to change that to Open street map?

Martin Middelkoop

If I would make the route in Here, it most likely will be identical to the navigation app.
But I would miss all the Bicycle routes. Is there a work around for this?

Reinhard-32

@Martin-Middelkoop
The Here maps are primary made for engine driven vehicles and not for bicycles. I have inspected your trip via street view and the added picture maybe explains why the routing at the here map is not possible between point 18 and 19.

Stefan Hummelink

@Martin-Middelkoop The behaviour you're seeing is completely expected since the Here map is different from the OpenStreetMap and it is very likely that the bicicyle roads you've been using in the OSM map, are not present in the Here map. This last point can actually be seen:

Road between wp11 and wp12 is recognized in the OpenStreetMap.
While in the Here map this road does not exist(disruption in the white road, shown by the Here overlay) and therefore the Here algorithm(used by the Navigation app) goes haywire. In fact it just calculates a route between wp11 and wp12 based on the roads it knows:

Unfortunately there is no way to change the map algorithm used by MRA Nagation. Not yet. Many people have requested this feature, but it remains to be seen if this will be developed. Maybe in the next roadmap?

One workaround may be to: create a lot of waypoints at the bicycle roads the Here map does not recognize (use the 'compare with Here' functionality from the toolkit), and set those addedn waypoints to Offroad/Skip. As soon as the MRA Navigation will handle offroad points correctly, you'll see straight lines on your screen between the waypoints but at least you can cycle the road :). For example:

Notice how the green line(Here calculation) now follows the black line(OpenStreetMap calculation) for all the 'Offroad' waypoints (it's underneath the black line very faintly) and how it stops at waypoint 21 because waypoint 22 is not set to 'offroad'

Drabslab

@Martin-Middelkoop The suggestion of Stefan may seem cumbersome, but it actually works. It is very close to the way of working in the early days of navigation, at times when the Garmin etrex was considered a miracle device, even when it could not calculate anything; It could only show on a tiny screen what your position was and where the next waypoint was. It had a massive 24Mb of internal memory.

still, I drove all the way to Italy with that thing (and back, of course) without needing a map.

Stefan Hummelink

@Drabslab @Martin-Middelkoop Although my proposed method works in theory, it does not work yet with MRA navigation since the app cannot distinguish normal waypoints from Offroad waypoints. Therefore routecalculation fails when too many offroad points are used. I made you happy with a dead bug.

My apologies. We'll have to wait for the developers to update the app so that this functionality is included in the navigation app as well.

Martin Middelkoop

@Drabslab @StefanHummelink Thanks. will wait for that possible update of the Navigation app