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Here sucks

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  • Kudeeundefined Kudee

    https://www.myrouteapp.com/route/open/7682159

    Nick Carthewundefined Offline
    Nick Carthewundefined Offline
    Nick Carthew
    RouteXpert
    wrote on last edited by
    #3

    @Kudee It looks to me as if route points 5 and 6 are not on a public road. This is why HERE will not route you. Turn into the docks at route point 4 and follow your nose, you don’t need to be able to navigate within the docks.

    Always willing to help if I can.
    Triumph Tiger 1200 XRT called Tina.
    MRA Navigation Next and SilverFox B8J bar buttons.
    Quadlock wireless mount for IPhone 11.
    Cardo Scala Packtalk Bold.
    TomTom Rider 500. (In the cupboard now)

    Kudeeundefined 1 Reply Last reply
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    • Nick Carthewundefined Nick Carthew

      @Kudee It looks to me as if route points 5 and 6 are not on a public road. This is why HERE will not route you. Turn into the docks at route point 4 and follow your nose, you don’t need to be able to navigate within the docks.

      Kudeeundefined Offline
      Kudeeundefined Offline
      Kudee
      wrote on last edited by
      #4

      @Nick-Carthew Thank you. Following my nose can not be the solution in 2023 and on a new APP! As I'm reading a lot in this forum I figured out out that many users are not happy with HERE. OSM is free and very good. Still wondering if Garmin and others are able to do the Job!
      Thank you

      Rob Verhoeffundefined richtea999undefined 2 Replies Last reply
      0
      • Kudeeundefined Kudee

        @Nick-Carthew Thank you. Following my nose can not be the solution in 2023 and on a new APP! As I'm reading a lot in this forum I figured out out that many users are not happy with HERE. OSM is free and very good. Still wondering if Garmin and others are able to do the Job!
        Thank you

        Rob Verhoeffundefined Offline
        Rob Verhoeffundefined Offline
        Rob Verhoeff
        Alpha tester
        wrote on last edited by
        #5

        @Kudee said in Here sucks:

        Still wondering if Garmin and others are able to do the Job!

        Garmin can't help you either... Garmin uses the same Here map!

        BMW K1600GT-P (2013) with BMW Navigator | Nolan N100-5 with Sena 30K
        iOS on iPhone 13 (mounted on Quadlock)
        Apple CarPlay in VW T-Roc (wired)
        Routelab on MacBook Air & iMac (Sequoia & Monterey)

        Kudeeundefined 1 Reply Last reply
        1
        • Rob Verhoeffundefined Rob Verhoeff

          @Kudee said in Here sucks:

          Still wondering if Garmin and others are able to do the Job!

          Garmin can't help you either... Garmin uses the same Here map!

          Kudeeundefined Offline
          Kudeeundefined Offline
          Kudee
          wrote on last edited by
          #6

          @Rob-Verhoeff Tested on BC?

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          • Kudeeundefined Kudee

            @Nick-Carthew Thank you. Following my nose can not be the solution in 2023 and on a new APP! As I'm reading a lot in this forum I figured out out that many users are not happy with HERE. OSM is free and very good. Still wondering if Garmin and others are able to do the Job!
            Thank you

            richtea999undefined Offline
            richtea999undefined Offline
            richtea999
            Valued contributor
            wrote on last edited by richtea999
            #7

            @Kudee said in Here sucks:

            OSM is free and very good. Still wondering if Garmin and others are able to do the Job!

            If you have Gold membership you can compare the OSM, Here, and TomTom routes all together on the map, and guess what - OSM is the worst in this particular case:

            • Black = HERE / Garmin
            • Red = TomTom
            • Blue = OSM

            OSM (blue) goes to the wrong dock. Hey ho.

            Screenshot 2023-07-21 at 20.32.18.png

            The trick (for me anyway, but I'm no expert) is to compare all three routing engines like I did in the above image, then select my opiion of the 'best' route, and force them to match with a few extra waypoints in the right places.

            If they all created exactly the same route, we wouldn't need 3 engines. In other words, there isn't necessarily always a 'correct' answer.
            [EDIT: In this case with the extra info, you can tell that TomTom has additional private land routing data, so in this case it's the best of the three, but it's not always so clear-cut.]

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            • Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
              Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
              Jure Sirena 0
              wrote on last edited by Jure Sirena 0
              #8

              There is a big reason why BMW a longtime biggest customer of Garmin has switched to tomtom…(R1250RT, new R1300 family and all new future bikes)

              Garmin overslept on maps and app developmemt.
              As a tour guide I need to use XT2 device but only way to do proper routes with no surprises is to use tomtom planer (mydrive or myroute) and put gpx on garmin.

              Last year I had several critics on HERE maps when riding Spain, Tunisia, France…..its like having maps from 2001.

              But its really map problem - not critisizimg the app or garmin device to be clear.

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              • richtea999undefined Offline
                richtea999undefined Offline
                richtea999
                Valued contributor
                wrote on last edited by richtea999
                #9

                To balance my previous comment a few minutes ago, I should also say I do have problems with HERE mapping too, sometimes on very basic routes - hence why I always compare all three routes.

                Here's a very basic failure:

                • a UK main road that runs from Burford southwards to Swindon
                • the road is a straight A road

                TomTom and OSM both route directly down the main road as I'm pretty sure all drivers do:
                Screenshot 2023-07-21 at 21.05.20.png

                HERE (the green line) deviates off into the villages and back again, for some reason:
                Screenshot 2023-07-21 at 21.06.35.png

                That's just weird.
                Does it know about some road closure? If so, I'd like to see it marked as such.

                Rob Verhoeffundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • richtea999undefined richtea999

                  To balance my previous comment a few minutes ago, I should also say I do have problems with HERE mapping too, sometimes on very basic routes - hence why I always compare all three routes.

                  Here's a very basic failure:

                  • a UK main road that runs from Burford southwards to Swindon
                  • the road is a straight A road

                  TomTom and OSM both route directly down the main road as I'm pretty sure all drivers do:
                  Screenshot 2023-07-21 at 21.05.20.png

                  HERE (the green line) deviates off into the villages and back again, for some reason:
                  Screenshot 2023-07-21 at 21.06.35.png

                  That's just weird.
                  Does it know about some road closure? If so, I'd like to see it marked as such.

                  Rob Verhoeffundefined Offline
                  Rob Verhoeffundefined Offline
                  Rob Verhoeff
                  Alpha tester
                  wrote on last edited by Rob Verhoeff
                  #10

                  @richtea999 doing some research, yes there is a road closure as you can see yourself if you activate the "Traffic overlay". You see a black line on the A361 (Gold feature). And, according to Englisch website with traffic info, you can find that yourself too.

                  Scherm­afbeelding 2023-07-21 om 22.32.47.png

                  Scherm­afbeelding 2023-07-21 om 22.35.28.png

                  BMW K1600GT-P (2013) with BMW Navigator | Nolan N100-5 with Sena 30K
                  iOS on iPhone 13 (mounted on Quadlock)
                  Apple CarPlay in VW T-Roc (wired)
                  Routelab on MacBook Air & iMac (Sequoia & Monterey)

                  richtea999undefined 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • Rob Verhoeffundefined Rob Verhoeff

                    @richtea999 doing some research, yes there is a road closure as you can see yourself if you activate the "Traffic overlay". You see a black line on the A361 (Gold feature). And, according to Englisch website with traffic info, you can find that yourself too.

                    Scherm­afbeelding 2023-07-21 om 22.32.47.png

                    Scherm­afbeelding 2023-07-21 om 22.35.28.png

                    richtea999undefined Offline
                    richtea999undefined Offline
                    richtea999
                    Valued contributor
                    wrote on last edited by richtea999
                    #11

                    @Rob-Verhoeff That is genius! And yet at the same time also horribly flawed.
                    Thanks very much for pointing it out to me. Much apppreciated.

                    Going somewhat off-thread, how do I stop routes that I'm planning months ahead from being warped by such dynamic real-time traffic information? Is there an option I've missed? Being to flip traffic re-routing on/off would show the problem points very nicely.

                    Rob Verhoeffundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • richtea999undefined richtea999

                      @Rob-Verhoeff That is genius! And yet at the same time also horribly flawed.
                      Thanks very much for pointing it out to me. Much apppreciated.

                      Going somewhat off-thread, how do I stop routes that I'm planning months ahead from being warped by such dynamic real-time traffic information? Is there an option I've missed? Being to flip traffic re-routing on/off would show the problem points very nicely.

                      Rob Verhoeffundefined Offline
                      Rob Verhoeffundefined Offline
                      Rob Verhoeff
                      Alpha tester
                      wrote on last edited by Rob Verhoeff
                      #12

                      @richtea999 said in Here sucks:

                      Going somewhat off-thread, how do I stop routes that I'm planning months ahead from being warped by such dynamic real-time traffic information? Is there an option I've missed?

                      "Disable seasonal closures" in the Toolkit-menu!

                      Scherm­afbeelding 2023-07-21 om 23.07.45.png

                      BMW K1600GT-P (2013) with BMW Navigator | Nolan N100-5 with Sena 30K
                      iOS on iPhone 13 (mounted on Quadlock)
                      Apple CarPlay in VW T-Roc (wired)
                      Routelab on MacBook Air & iMac (Sequoia & Monterey)

                      richtea999undefined 1 Reply Last reply
                      1
                      • Rob Verhoeffundefined Rob Verhoeff

                        @richtea999 said in Here sucks:

                        Going somewhat off-thread, how do I stop routes that I'm planning months ahead from being warped by such dynamic real-time traffic information? Is there an option I've missed?

                        "Disable seasonal closures" in the Toolkit-menu!

                        Scherm­afbeelding 2023-07-21 om 23.07.45.png

                        richtea999undefined Offline
                        richtea999undefined Offline
                        richtea999
                        Valued contributor
                        wrote on last edited by richtea999
                        #13

                        @Rob-Verhoeff
                        Ah - doubly excellent! Gold star to you.

                        I thought 'Seasonal closures' referred to the Alps passes since the UK really doesn't have any seasonal closures, and all the discussion I read about that option was Alpine pass-related. Bad assumption.

                        Maybe MRA could rename it to:

                        • 'Ignore traffic issues & road closures'.

                        Or maybe

                        • 'Static routing (ignore traffic and closures)'

                        Anyway, apologies for hijacking the thread. Back to the original issue, the point still stands about it being good practice to compare all three routing engines - just in case.

                        Rob Verhoeffundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • richtea999undefined richtea999

                          @Rob-Verhoeff
                          Ah - doubly excellent! Gold star to you.

                          I thought 'Seasonal closures' referred to the Alps passes since the UK really doesn't have any seasonal closures, and all the discussion I read about that option was Alpine pass-related. Bad assumption.

                          Maybe MRA could rename it to:

                          • 'Ignore traffic issues & road closures'.

                          Or maybe

                          • 'Static routing (ignore traffic and closures)'

                          Anyway, apologies for hijacking the thread. Back to the original issue, the point still stands about it being good practice to compare all three routing engines - just in case.

                          Rob Verhoeffundefined Offline
                          Rob Verhoeffundefined Offline
                          Rob Verhoeff
                          Alpha tester
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #14

                          @richtea999 Or just "Disable traffic & seasonal closings". One word can make the differance. Like your idea.

                          BMW K1600GT-P (2013) with BMW Navigator | Nolan N100-5 with Sena 30K
                          iOS on iPhone 13 (mounted on Quadlock)
                          Apple CarPlay in VW T-Roc (wired)
                          Routelab on MacBook Air & iMac (Sequoia & Monterey)

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