Skipping waypoint button.
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@Herko-ter-Horst said in Skipping waypoint button.:
I would have loved for MRA Navigation Next to be an improvement over my current solution in terms of ease-of-use and integration with MRA Routeplanner, but it looks like it's not going to be for the foreseeable future. Too bad.
I think ease of use is not only dependent on having turn-by-turn track navigation. There are benefits in track navigation, there are also disadvantages, we have been discussing this before. Most disadvantages play a little role for those using the complete MRA ecosystem. All those using the dedicates satnavs already have the possibility to ride tracks. For you track-navigation seems to be a "must-have" for me it is absolutely not. But I agree with you that the combination of the two can have it's merits.
@Tim-Thompson said in Skipping waypoint button.:
Having the ability to navigate using tracks would also improve the experience for people that plan their routes outside the ecosystem as well.
I really think that is not explicitly the target for MRA. I think Navigation is targeted at planner users and not at users of other planning tools, but:
@Tim-Thompson said in Skipping waypoint button.:
Planning and importing both routes and tracks into MRA would likely become immensly more handy
I think it is already very handy since you can import tracks into planner. It is about the same thing as exporting a track to a Garmin and import it to ride as a trip. And I am confident the integration of Next into Mobile will make that even simpler.
@Con-Hennekens said in Skipping waypoint button.:
@Herko-ter-Horst said in Skipping waypoint button.:
I would have loved for MRA Navigation Next to be an improvement over my current solution in terms of ease-of-use and integration with MRA Routeplanner, but it looks like it's not going to be for the foreseeable future. Too bad.
I think ease of use is not only dependent on having turn-by-turn track navigation. There are benefits in track navigation, there are also disadvantages, we have been discussing this before. Most disadvantages play a little role for those using the complete MRA ecosystem. All those using the dedicates satnavs already have the possibility to ride tracks. For you track-navigation seems to be a "must-have" for me it is absolutely not. But I agree with you that the combination of the two can have it's merits.
Like I said, I get that my issue number 1 is less problematic if you are only using MRA. However "putting a shaping point on every road I plan to travel on", as Steve mentions, just to prevent the navigation app from messing up my route, is not a good use of my time. And having to skip waypoints while driving/riding isn't either and also isn't magically 'solved' by using only MRA.
I see the first issue (recalculating the route from waypoints at navigation time) as an unsolvable issue of the 'waypoints' approach, that is only mitigated by having to 'optimise' for a single app if you use only MRA (which I and the people I often drive with don't). I could see the second issue (skipping waypoints) as potentially solvable by a (much) smarter auto-skip algorithm.
As I've mentioned before as well, the main drawback of navigating using a track is the fact that current apps/devices (that I know of) disregard waypoints altogether in this mode. This is where I hoped MRA Navigation Next would improve: by showing/announcing waypoints while using the track to navigate, I figured you'd get the best of both worlds: no need for extra work during planning (if the route looks good during planning, it will be the same during navigation, no need to add more waypoints than strictly needed), no more skipping waypoints (they are not used for navigation, so there's no need to skip anything), but still have the visual (and/or aural) benefit of having waypoints for stops, viewpoints, etc.
My current solution does allow me to add points of interest manually, which are then displayed on the map while navigating, so it's almost there, but adding the POIs is a manual, additional step, which isn't very convenient.
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Personally on my Garmin XT I never bother to make the Track Visible as I put at least 1 shaping point on every road I plan to travel on, no matter how long the route is.
I never add Via Points to any of my routes as I prefer to ride alone.
I stop whenever I need, to stretch the legs, eat, drink or just take in the scenery etc.
If "she who must be obeyed" is on the bike with me then I will use MRA Navigation as well as the XT, just using Shaping Points still, but coloured red for stops on MRA Navigation.
Personally, I prefer waypoint based navigation rather than tracks@Steve-Lynch said in Skipping waypoint button.:
... "she who must be obeyed"
Mine has her own bike.I think your and mine methods are quite similar. Also I am not too frantic about taking the first or the second road left or right. MRA Navigation almost immediately shows the next best route to the next shaping point. Most of the time I do not bother to turn around anymore, everything fixes itself automatically.
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master has a point that sharing routes is most reliable using the track. That's also why it is invented in the first place. Cross-platform compatibility.
And @Herko-ter-Horst has a point too, that waypoints being shown on a track-route would be a nice addition.
In the meantime I really appreciate how it works now too. I think for people within the ecosystem the need is much less. But loading a GPX directly into Navigation is more handy than uploading it in the planner and press "use as route".
I am just an enthusiastic MRA user, and hope you will be one too!
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebar to the saddle.
Streetpilot 2610/Zumo 660/Zumo 395/ CAT S52 + MRA app -
@Steve-Lynch said in Skipping waypoint button.:
... "she who must be obeyed"
Mine has her own bike.I think your and mine methods are quite similar. Also I am not too frantic about taking the first or the second road left or right. MRA Navigation almost immediately shows the next best route to the next shaping point. Most of the time I do not bother to turn around anymore, everything fixes itself automatically.
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master has a point that sharing routes is most reliable using the track. That's also why it is invented in the first place. Cross-platform compatibility.
And @Herko-ter-Horst has a point too, that waypoints being shown on a track-route would be a nice addition.
In the meantime I really appreciate how it works now too. I think for people within the ecosystem the need is much less. But loading a GPX directly into Navigation is more handy than uploading it in the planner and press "use as route".
I used to do group rides but in my experience the inevitable happens and some Rossi wananbe on an R6 turns it into a race.
My method of placing a Shaping Point on every road I plan to travel on is a bit over the top, but I actually find it quite therapeutic planning routes in MRA.
Particularly as I generally use the Tom Tom Maps for their curvy algorithm.
My device however, is a Garmin XT, so I overlay the Tom Tom Track with waypoints then switch to Here and correct the slight differences in the maps.
I am also aware that the Track is the best option for sharing but I prefer to travel alone or with "she who must be obeyed".My preferred road types are those Country Lanes with the moss/grass in the middle and no pavements.
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@Steve-Lynch said in Skipping waypoint button.:
... "she who must be obeyed"
Mine has her own bike.I think your and mine methods are quite similar. Also I am not too frantic about taking the first or the second road left or right. MRA Navigation almost immediately shows the next best route to the next shaping point. Most of the time I do not bother to turn around anymore, everything fixes itself automatically.
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master has a point that sharing routes is most reliable using the track. That's also why it is invented in the first place. Cross-platform compatibility.
And @Herko-ter-Horst has a point too, that waypoints being shown on a track-route would be a nice addition.
In the meantime I really appreciate how it works now too. I think for people within the ecosystem the need is much less. But loading a GPX directly into Navigation is more handy than uploading it in the planner and press "use as route".
@Con-Hennekens said in Skipping waypoint button.:
And @Herko-ter-Horst has a point too, that waypoints being shown on a track-route would be a nice addition.
If you use the gpx 1.2, you basically have a track with viapoints
gpx 1.2 on my XT with only the viapoints
Purple - route
Black = Track
Recalculation must be OFF
Garmin Zumo XT2/XT/BMW Connected Ride Navigator/MyRouteapp (The App)
Een dag niet gelachen is een dag niet geleefd / Een route is net zo goed als deze uitgezet is. -
@Con-Hennekens said in Skipping waypoint button.:
And @Herko-ter-Horst has a point too, that waypoints being shown on a track-route would be a nice addition.
If you use the gpx 1.2, you basically have a track with viapoints
gpx 1.2 on my XT with only the viapoints
Purple - route
Black = Track
Recalculation must be OFF@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master Are you suggesting MRA Navigation Next should be replaced by a Garmin Zumo XT? Surely not...
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@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master Are you suggesting MRA Navigation Next should be replaced by a Garmin Zumo XT? Surely not...
@Herko-ter-Horst
No, definitely not. I just gave the example of using the gpx 1.2 icm with a Zumo XT, where you basically have a track with waypoints.Garmin Zumo XT2/XT/BMW Connected Ride Navigator/MyRouteapp (The App)
Een dag niet gelachen is een dag niet geleefd / Een route is net zo goed als deze uitgezet is. -
@Herko-ter-Horst
No, definitely not. I just gave the example of using the gpx 1.2 icm with a Zumo XT, where you basically have a track with waypoints.@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master I'm not sure of the relevance of this to the discussion at hand. The track is not used for navigation, just for display purposes. If you miss one or more waypoints, you'll still need to (manually?) skip them, right? And also: it has nothing to do with MRA Navigation (Next).
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@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master I'm not sure of the relevance of this to the discussion at hand. The track is not used for navigation, just for display purposes. If you miss one or more waypoints, you'll still need to (manually?) skip them, right? And also: it has nothing to do with MRA Navigation (Next).
@Herko-ter-Horst said in Skipping waypoint button.:
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master I'm not sure of the relevance of this to the discussion at hand. The track is not used for navigation, just for display purposes. If you miss one or more waypoints, you'll still need to (manually?) skip them, right? And also: it has nothing to do with MRA Navigation (Next).
I largely agree that this discussion is not really relevant for NEXT, although at the same time it is very relevant
What I mean is that as a user, I want NEXT to display a coherent, consistent and correct (whatever correct may be) behaviour when guiding me over a route.
And I can think of many user oriented "features" that this behaviour should include:
- warn me when I approach a speed trap
- indicate road blockages and, upon my request, change the route around those
- play a prerecorded vocal message when I am close to a specific POI
- and so on
To my knowledge none of these can be done only on basis of a track, or a route compatible with Garmin or TomTom.
and as a user (forget for a minute that I am a computer addict) I don't care as long as NEXT delivers on all this.
It is up to MRA to decide the technical solutions for all this and If they are able to provide such technical solutions then the Garmin-TomTom-track-route discussion will be over because the MRA eco system will provide a much better service, that can't be moved to other devices.
This, of course, only if Corjan starts typing faster
It is not difficult, it is easy, it's a hobby
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@Herko-ter-Horst said in Skipping waypoint button.:
@Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master I'm not sure of the relevance of this to the discussion at hand. The track is not used for navigation, just for display purposes. If you miss one or more waypoints, you'll still need to (manually?) skip them, right? And also: it has nothing to do with MRA Navigation (Next).
I largely agree that this discussion is not really relevant for NEXT, although at the same time it is very relevant
What I mean is that as a user, I want NEXT to display a coherent, consistent and correct (whatever correct may be) behaviour when guiding me over a route.
And I can think of many user oriented "features" that this behaviour should include:
- warn me when I approach a speed trap
- indicate road blockages and, upon my request, change the route around those
- play a prerecorded vocal message when I am close to a specific POI
- and so on
To my knowledge none of these can be done only on basis of a track, or a route compatible with Garmin or TomTom.
and as a user (forget for a minute that I am a computer addict) I don't care as long as NEXT delivers on all this.
It is up to MRA to decide the technical solutions for all this and If they are able to provide such technical solutions then the Garmin-TomTom-track-route discussion will be over because the MRA eco system will provide a much better service, that can't be moved to other devices.
This, of course, only if Corjan starts typing faster
@Drabslab said in Skipping waypoint button.:
"then the Garmin-TomTom-track-route discussion will be over because the MRA eco system will provide a much better service, that can't be moved to other devices"
Spot on
Oh and stop teasing @Corjan-Meijerink or we'll send a fleet of Triumph Tigers to run you off the road You don’t stop riding when you get old, you get old when you stop riding.
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@Drabslab said in Skipping waypoint button.:
"then the Garmin-TomTom-track-route discussion will be over because the MRA eco system will provide a much better service, that can't be moved to other devices"
Spot on
Oh and stop teasing @Corjan-Meijerink or we'll send a fleet of Triumph Tigers to run you off the road @Steve-Lynch said in Skipping waypoint button.:
or we'll send a fleet of Triumph Tigers to run you off the road
Be careful, Steve, be VERY careful:
https://www.myrouteapp.com/blog/open/1168
It is not difficult, it is easy, it's a hobby
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@Steve-Lynch @Drabslab That fleet of Tigers would be fun! I can handle some teasing
Would like to share with you that I actually drove a test route with Navigation Next!
The UI is still a very early version and I’m not even sure if it will be shown like this at all for route navigation. This screen is actually used to preview a A-B route. But for testing I abused it to display my test route. Regardless, it was the only image I got to share I actually drove a route today
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@Steve-Lynch said in Skipping waypoint button.:
or we'll send a fleet of Triumph Tigers to run you off the road
Be careful, Steve, be VERY careful:
https://www.myrouteapp.com/blog/open/1168
@Drabslab
Great Blog.
I toyed with the idea of having a GS and had multiple test rides on the Standard GS1250. Very planted bike at low and high speeds. And seriously, who likes chain cleaning and maintenance,
In the end it came down money, and I just couldn't justify the cost difference Vs Specification between the Beemer and the Triumph Tiger 900 Rally Pro.
You don’t stop riding when you get old, you get old when you stop riding.
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@Steve-Lynch @Drabslab That fleet of Tigers would be fun! I can handle some teasing
Would like to share with you that I actually drove a test route with Navigation Next!
The UI is still a very early version and I’m not even sure if it will be shown like this at all for route navigation. This screen is actually used to preview a A-B route. But for testing I abused it to display my test route. Regardless, it was the only image I got to share I actually drove a route today
@Corjan-Meijerink waw, first test drive, that is progress. Careful when test driving, staring at the little screen can be dangerous.
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@Drabslab
Great Blog.
I toyed with the idea of having a GS and had multiple test rides on the Standard GS1250. Very planted bike at low and high speeds. And seriously, who likes chain cleaning and maintenance,
In the end it came down money, and I just couldn't justify the cost difference Vs Specification between the Beemer and the Triumph Tiger 900 Rally Pro.@Steve-Lynch cost was also the limiting factor for me. But i am very happy with ktm. The only big weakness is the battery. In the garage, i always must put a charger on as the battery runs empty in a week
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@Steve-Lynch @Drabslab That fleet of Tigers would be fun! I can handle some teasing
Would like to share with you that I actually drove a test route with Navigation Next!
The UI is still a very early version and I’m not even sure if it will be shown like this at all for route navigation. This screen is actually used to preview a A-B route. But for testing I abused it to display my test route. Regardless, it was the only image I got to share I actually drove a route today
Looking at your screenshot, is Route Point 1 your current location or the start of the Route?
Seems strange to plot half the route with no Route Points?
Was that just to demonstrate that MRA Next will offer options to save time.
As I ride purely for pleasure I have no interest in the the fastest route.
Personally I would never leave half a route without any Route Points.You don’t stop riding when you get old, you get old when you stop riding.
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Looking at your screenshot, is Route Point 1 your current location or the start of the Route?
Seems strange to plot half the route with no Route Points?
Was that just to demonstrate that MRA Next will offer options to save time.
As I ride purely for pleasure I have no interest in the the fastest route.
Personally I would never leave half a route without any Route Points.@Steve-Lynch said in Skipping waypoint button.:
Looking at your screenshot, is Route Point 1 your current location or the start of the Route?
Seems strange to plot half the route with no Route Points?
Was that just to demonstrate that MRA Next will offer options to save time.
As I ride purely for pleasure I have no interest in the the fastest route.
Personally I would never leave half a route without any Route Points.Hi @Steve-Lynch I’m sure Corjan won’t mind me answering for him, he’s a busy man. The route shown in the screenshot is a test route. There are many parameters to test and I expect one of them is how the routing algorithm manages long gaps between route points.
I know that Corjan will correct me if I’m wrong.Always willing to help if I can.
Triumph Tiger 1200 XRT called Tina.
MRA Navigation Next and SilverFox B8J bar buttons.
Quadlock wireless mount for IPhone 11.
Cardo Scala Packtalk Bold.
TomTom Rider 500. (In the cupboard now) -
Looking at your screenshot, is Route Point 1 your current location or the start of the Route?
Seems strange to plot half the route with no Route Points?
Was that just to demonstrate that MRA Next will offer options to save time.
As I ride purely for pleasure I have no interest in the the fastest route.
Personally I would never leave half a route without any Route Points.@Steve-Lynch Point 1 was the start of the route. I drove to that location (a motorcycle dealer) using the A-B route calculation as test.
From point 1 I took the fastest route (highway) to point 2. The following waypoints were merely to shape the route to my preference
The alternative route displayed (grey line) is an A-B route calculation feature. As mentioned, the screen as shown in my screenshot was that of A-B route generation but slightly abused by me to display a quick route. Normally we wouldn’t show alternative routes when loading a stored route. So yeah, purely testing here but thought it would be nice to share an image
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@Steve-Lynch said in Skipping waypoint button.:
Looking at your screenshot, is Route Point 1 your current location or the start of the Route?
Seems strange to plot half the route with no Route Points?
Was that just to demonstrate that MRA Next will offer options to save time.
As I ride purely for pleasure I have no interest in the the fastest route.
Personally I would never leave half a route without any Route Points.Hi @Steve-Lynch I’m sure Corjan won’t mind me answering for him, he’s a busy man. The route shown in the screenshot is a test route. There are many parameters to test and I expect one of them is how the routing algorithm manages long gaps between route points.
I know that Corjan will correct me if I’m wrong.@Nick-Carthew You literally just beat me to it hahah
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@Steve-Lynch said in Skipping waypoint button.:
Looking at your screenshot, is Route Point 1 your current location or the start of the Route?
Seems strange to plot half the route with no Route Points?
Was that just to demonstrate that MRA Next will offer options to save time.
As I ride purely for pleasure I have no interest in the the fastest route.
Personally I would never leave half a route without any Route Points.Hi @Steve-Lynch I’m sure Corjan won’t mind me answering for him, he’s a busy man. The route shown in the screenshot is a test route. There are many parameters to test and I expect one of them is how the routing algorithm manages long gaps between route points.
I know that Corjan will correct me if I’m wrong.@Nick-Carthew @Corjan-Meijerink
Thank you both for the clarification.
It was the visible grey route that confused me. -
Most often I ride with a group of friends, most of them use TomTom and I use the imported GPX. Which means I usually have a lot of waypoint. Even after checking the route and comparing them in the route planner there will always be points when the TomTom route uses roads that are not in the Here map and such. The auto skip waypoints function usually has no problem with that but not always. Having to skip waypoint whilst driving is far from ideal. Asking the group to stop whilst I fumble with the buttons isn't ideal either. I would like a much bigger button for skipping waypoints and a option to skip to the next point in the direction I am driving . For example when we take a shortcut and thereby skipping several waypoints. I would like to have the option to choose skip till next waypoint in driving direction. Now I have to push the tiny "next" button several times before I get to the waypoint that is coming up whilst driving and that is far from ideal.
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