Reverse Route

[Russ 1]

Hi All,
I used the reverse route function for the first time on a trip this last week. It plotted it great on the map, but little did I realize when I went to use it, on the trip that it kept trying to reroute me to turn around. It seems it reverses the route alright but the original route, waypoints are on the other side of the road, so each waypoint you hit it wants you to turn around to hit the other side of the road. Not sure if I did something wrong or was suppose to then go and move the waypoints to the other side of the road but if that's the case not a whole lot of point of using this feature if your are moving each waypoint anyway. I managed to just keep hitting skip waypoint but can get very confusing when in unfamiliar areas.

[Stefan Hummelink]

@Russ-1 moving a waypoint to the other side of the road is a lot less of a hassle than rearranging your waypoint such that last waypoint becomes first, second last becomes second first and so on. Use the function to reverse the route, but ALWAYS in any case, no matter the actions you do, check waypoint placement.

[Drabslab]

@Russ-1 You just have completely explained a probelm I had this year with a route that I reversed from an existing route in my library.

In practie, and while driving, the route was unusable and I replaced it by entering the end desination in the GPS and riding the fastest route".

It may be true that reversing and then placing all the waypints on the other side on the raod is much faster than moving all point individually but a strong warning on the screen while reversing may also be useful.

[Nick Carthew]

@Drabslab @Matt-Flaming
I’m not a developer so I cannot comment with complete accuracy but my feelings are that it would be virtually impossible for the algorithm to work out which side of the road to choose on a dual carriageway. Reversing a route just reverses the order of route points. The algorithm would need to reposition RPs to accommodate dual carriageways and find an alternative route for one way roads.
This isn’t a problem if you just have an A to B route or if you haven’t placed any intermediary RPs on dual carriageways or one way streets.
And as far as I know, no GPS device can accurately reverse a route but I’m happy to be educated.

[Hans van de Ven MR.MRA]

@Matt-Flaming

I think the distance in MRA Navigation is set to 25 or 50 meters. So if you pass a via point within a radius of 25 or 50 meters, it is considered visited.

[Nick Carthew]

@Matt-Flaming The solution is simple and quick (less than a minute for most routes). Fully zoom into route point 1 by using the magnifying glass adjust if required and then use the right arrow to move to RP 2. Do this for all RPs and your route will be trouble free.

The same advice for reversing a route.

[Hans van de Ven MR.MRA]

@Matt-Flaming

That is normal, you must always make sure that you place the waypoints on the correct side of the road, by zooming in to the maximum and placing the waypoint exactly on the route line, pay attention after roundabouts, highways, roads with separated lanes

[Drabslab]

@Nick-Carthew I agree but it does explain for me that I had so much difficulties with some routes lately that I had reversed, and never thought of checking the position of the waypoints again.

Hence, I was just flagging en error of me, myself and I, not criticizing MRA.

[Drabslab]

@Matt-Flaming except forMRA Nav, this will perhaps more depend on the GPs you are using

[Jack van Tilburg]

@Drabslab said in Reverse Route:

@Nick-Carthew I agree but it does explain for me that I had so much difficulties with some routes lately that I had reversed, and never thought of checking the position of the waypoints again.

Hence, I was just flagging en error of me, myself and I, not criticizing MRA.

When I reverse a route, I make a copy of the original. I reverse the copy route. Then I compare the length of the copy with the original. If it deviates, I check the route.
If the distance doesn't deviate too much, I don't check the route. I will come up with a solution in unexpected situations while driving.

[Jack van Tilburg]

@Matt-Flaming said in Reverse Route:

I'm astonished by the apologetic and defensive nature of this forum. It seems that any comment that goes against the current design is met with "NO, YOU'RE WRONG".

I get what you mean but I don't feel it that way.
I think this forum is meant to help fellow users with knowledge and if necessary with work-arounds if the tool falls short.
At the same time, I see that innovations are constantly being implemented in the MRA planner that are based on user experiences and proposals. As a result, the Roadmap is often deviated from in order to offer a quick solution or improvement.

[Jack van Tilburg]

@Matt-Flaming said in Reverse Route:
I do not use MRA Nav and therefore do not get involved in topics related to MRA Nav. With regard to MRA Planner, I have already mentioned my experience above.
I definitely agree that it's a shame there isn't a forum section for request threads. But I do realize that there is a risk that with such a topic opinions and ideas quickly go 1000 ways, so that it does not necessarily lead to desired solutions. This requires good control of the content.

[Nick Carthew]

@Matt-Flaming said in Reverse Route:

LOL.

I should know better by now, that this forum is just an echo chamber of praise for the product, rather than any acceptance that there are areas of improvement that could be made.

That’s a very unfair and incorrect comment Matt. There have been many topics reporting issues in this forum, these have been acknowledged and more often than not, resolved.

I know HOW I could fix the WP, but I shouldn't have to...that's kind of the point of having a smart system that handles stuff like this.

As I said in a previous reply; as far as I know there are no GPS devices that will accurately reverse a route that has route points on a dual carriageways. The trick is to know the product and it’s limitations.

So in your mind, if I find myself on the route and a WP is off by a bit, I should stop, and adjust the route, then somehow re-export this route out and pass it out to my group?

No, you should thoroughly check the route first by fully zooming in to each route point before sharing the route to your group. I would also turn the traffic on to check for any roadworks or closures for a group ride.

I'm astonished by the apologetic and defensive nature of this forum. It seems that any comment that goes against the current design is met with "NO, YOU'RE WRONG".

I’m astonished that after all of the help that you’ve received from this forum, you’re still having problems!

[Nick Carthew]

@Matt-Flaming said in Reverse Route:

@Jack-van-Tilburg said in Reverse Route:

@Matt-Flaming said in Reverse Route:

It just seems that when someone says "This is where the product could improve", someone comes along and says, "No, you're just doing/thinking/looking at it the wrong way. You have to do it like this." When I am not referring to HOW it can be done in the current system, but rather it could be better if you provided these options.

Matt, can you point to posts where you have made suggestions for improvements and have been told “No, you’re just doing/thinking/looking at it the wrong way”.
MRA have always been open to suggestions for improvement.

As a user, nearly every idea getting shot down by others in the forum is discouraging, and makes me use the system less and less.

With the greatest respect Matt, I don’t recall you making any suggestions and subsequently being shot down for them. Again, can you point me to these please.

We have no say-so in the NAV app, there is no roadmap published for it, and the roadmap for the planner is published in a manner that doesn't encourage new ideas or modifications. "This is our plan for the system, deal with it"

How come we don't have request threads (that we can vote for features)?

The current roadmap for the route planner came from requests from users that were voted for in this forum.

How come we don't have any way to provide feedback other than creating a post or comment only to get shot down by long time veterans of the forum as "Do it this way. The way you want to do it will never exist"?

Where else would you suggest providing feedback and what’s wrong with leaving feedback in this forum?

[Hans van de Ven MR.MRA]

@Matt-Flaming

The development team is working hard on the roadmap and bugs that appears.

When the roadmap is finished, there will be a new roadmap, based on user input.

Till that time learn to work with the software, yes it different as other software that you can use / buy, but overall there are many happy users.

Hope that you understand that the development team is sticked to the roadmap and solving bugs, your issue is not a bug.

[Nick Carthew]

@Matt-Flaming said in Reverse Route:

@Nick-Carthew said in Reverse Route:

Where else would you suggest providing feedback and what’s wrong with leaving feedback in this forum?

Nothing, but why can't we have feature request threads like other products? I've seen other threads get ignored because "we have a feature requests thread already" (even though those threads are closed to further discussion...

There was a feature request topic, the topic was closed because the suggested features were included in the current roadmap and are being implemented. No doubt that there will be another feature request topic when the current roadmap is complete.

You have to understand that this software isn't cheap. I paid good money for a whole cohesive solution, and got a half working product. I am going to remain bitter about the lack of motivation to actually FIX the problems that have been reported, and the lack of motivation to improve a product. I bought into the entire thing with the understanding that I could use the planner and the nav app together...only to get the planner with the nav app being completely and utterly useless.

I have to again disagree with you. There is not a lack of motivation on MRAs behalf to fix and improve their product. Why would a young and expanding company lack motivation? New features and improvements to existing features are rolled out regularly.
Have you ever tried to contact any of the bigger players? (Almost impossible) For instance, TomTom have had an ongoing problem for over a year where iPhones cannot connect via MyDrive to TomTom Rider devices despite all of their marketing suggesting they are compatible. TomTom refuse to address the problem.

I have mentioned before my thoughts on waypoints being TOO sensitive with the entire thing, but was told, "YOU JUST HAVE TO ZOOM IN INCREDIBLY CLOSE TO ADJUST YOUR WAYPOINT! GOSH!". WHY? I don't have to in other planning apps. Weird. Again, this points directly to some users in the forums defending the product, rather than acknowledging that others might have valid points.

I don’t have a problem with positioning route points accurately on the road, in fact I find it quite pleasing.
I have to ask, and I’m not being confrontational or awkward, but if you find other route planners easier to use and more to your liking, why persevere with MRA? I’m genuinely interested to know.

[Hans van de Ven MR.MRA]

@Matt-Flaming
Hi Matt,
MRA continues to improve by listening carefully to the customers, but not every customer wish is immediately picked up and built in, that is simply not possible. That is why the roadmap was created, and the team is now working on it.

You simply have to place route points correctly on the road, especially if you use the reverse option, an extra check on where the route points are located. I understand it's frustrating for you when you're driving and you keep getting sent back to a previous point, but this is also a learning moment for you, you don't forget this.

[Con Hennekens]

@Matt-Flaming said in Reverse Route:

@Nick-Carthew said in Reverse Route:

as far as I know there are no GPS devices that will accurately reverse a route that has route points on a dual carriageways

I never suggested that there are. I was merely pointing out a flaw that I see in the current system, that I would like to see improved. That flaw being the waypoints, which you are pretty defensive of and apparently don't think they need any work?

Why do you expect a totally different behaviour from MRA than from any other routeplanner? It will be my day when a routeplanner goes moving routepoints that I have set deliberately... Routepoints need to be set with a plan in mind. If the plan changes (reversing e.g.) that can affect waypoints. That cannot be automated, and I would not want that to be automated.

I know of no tools that require the level of detail that you HAVE to provide as much as MRA. On other planning apps, I can just drag the line where I want and it routes me, regardless of which side of the road it thinks it's on. Why do I have to zoom in and get so detailed with every route?

Dragging lines or placing waypoints is exactly the same. From my days with Basecamp and Mapsource I remember the same problem concerning splitted driveways, if you set a waypoint on the wrong lane.

You obviously like another routeplanner better. What is keeping you from using that one instead of MRA?

[Con Hennekens]

@Matt-Flaming said in Reverse Route:

Because I was hoping to get the all-inclusive, all-encompassing software solution that is printed on the box...the one that advertises MRA Planner and MRA Nav as a complete alternative to Garmin/TomTom...

I mean, I paid for it, it seems like I should be able to use it.

I still see no exaggeration in that marketing. Concerning car and motor navigation that is, about walking and cycling some things can be said... I have a Garmin and all software that goes with it, I haven't touched it in three years. I think that when you embrace the whatever quirks you see in MRA, like you obviously have embraced the quirks of other routeplanners, you can be quite satisfied with MRA. MRA has proven to listen to customers pretty good and no, not all of my input has been developed either. It is not so nice to keep attacking them about it, as if your ideas are more important then others.

[Exilfranke]

Dear all,

time to have a short break - have a coffee or (maybe better for calming down) a beer or whatever one prefers.

I agree with Matt - a more intelligent handling of waypoints would be really cool.
This holds true for reversing routes or when "droppping" waypoints by clicking into the map or dragging the route.
Would be great if I would NOT have to manually check all waypoints, but if they magically would find the best place (depending on the zoom factor or whatsoever).

However, this is just one of many feature requests - no idea how easy it could be implemented or what would be the given priority.
But once again I agree, that a feature request should be treated differently than a call for help.

Currently when you create a new topic, you will get a little bit of everything: helpful info, best practices, opinions, etc., which means, when you request a feature or report a bug, the forum members also respond with their favorite best practices or workarounds.
I'm trying to take this as an offer for help - not as an general objection to the point (I'm not always successful with this mental excercise, though ).

So please everybody calm down a little - all in all it's a great forum with great members!

Cheers, Sven