Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort
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schon mit beta 304 beschrieb ich ein Problem zu meiner 8 km Testrunde zum Gym.
Habe heute, um vielleicht selbst Ursachen zu finden ein paar Änderungen vorgenommen.
Hinweis: Gelbe und grüne WPs sind so attributiert, dass sie angesagt werden, ebenso klar das Ziel als roter WP. Tatsächlicher Start ist vor WP1 grün.
Blaue WPs enthalten Ziffern, keinen Infotext und werden somit nicht angesagt.
Route hin zum Gym
Bild Hier
WP 8 etwas vorgezogen, somit nun genug „Zeit“ um den WP als auch die folgende Abbiegeanweisung anzusagen. Zuvor war der WP nach der Abbiegung vor dem Kreisverkehr und es fehlten Ansagen.
Auch im Krriesverkejr „Nehmen sie die 2. Ausfahrt ist korrekt, Car mode im settingAlles somit, unter wohl notwendiger Beachtung von Entfernungen, in Ordnung. All notwendigen Ansagen wurden genannt, die blauen WP, sind ohne Ansage
Jetzt Bild der Rückfahrt identische Strecke.
Alles beginnt wie erwartet und ist richtig bis zur angesagten Abbiegung nach angesagtem WP4
Zu WP5 bis 7 erfolgt keine Ansage. Erst die Zielankunft wird ab 1000 Meter zuvor angekündigt.Corjan, was funktioniert da nicht? Das ist unbefriedigend.
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@Peter-Schiefer waypoints 5, 6 & 7 won't be announced as they contain numbers.
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@RetiredWingMan said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
@Peter-Schiefer waypoints 5, 6 & 7 won't be announced as they contain numbers.
Sorry no, because in the additional remark field is a text.
On the route to the gym it works correct -
Ich habe das gleiches problem. Deine einstellung fur ansagen steht auf alle, nicht nur auf "Via"?
Wann ich die einstellung auf "alle" eingestelt ist. functioniert das ansagen auch niet correct bei mir. Wann die einstellung auf "Via" steht is alle schon gut bei mir.
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@M-Schrijver
Correct, my setting is for announcement „all“.The Manual says, shaping points with digits will not be announced, when setting is on „all“ or need a text, a single word is enough, in the comment field.
Via points even when not the final destination will be announced all the time.MRA has for me some nasty bad funcionalty here.
Reference is my Garmin.In the past I used all the time on my Garmin Via points also for shaping and for me it was helpful respektive rather important that the via point which were at Garmin (and before on my Navigons) handled as a final destination with first announcemt about 1 Km before and repeated until reached like her MRA do so with the final destination too.
this practice confirmed me that I respectiv my Satnav follows the route as planed.
Later Garmin introduced shaping points, may due to the limit per Route of 49 Vias and request by users. These are now named Wp without alarm, mean no call.What is now for me bad her at MRA.
If you use shaping points with text you get a call about 800 to 600 meters before you reach the SP on the map.
If you use a Viapoint for e.g. an interim Stop you got the call direct after passing the last SP only once and not anymore when you get closer and with a Countdown call like the final destination. The distance from the last SP to your interim can be 3, 6 or 10 kilometersTo get a call for an interim stop on time respective close to the point you have two possibilities. Set a SP about 1 km before the Viapoint.
Or split the route, so that the interim coffe stop get the final position.
If you like now for sample to have 3 Stops per day at different targets, a coffee break, a lunch, visit of a museum, you got three routes on your list, database
And this is (for me) nonsense.Garmin starts at each WP with alarm automatically a new calculation to the next Via, the best way.
Apple Maps request a confirmation with a red button to continue very easily.
Google too, but with a bit confusing reaction and info. -
What you mentioned about MRA Next confirms what i found.
When i have a Viapoint with a note. I set a shaping point a few hunderd meters (300-500) before the Viapoint just like you do.What happened to me was:
I tried it once for a section of a trip and the behaviour of MRA Next was very bad.
Around 70% of the shaping point were announced as "next stop" or something like that (i don't know english translation of the dutch announcement).
Most direction changes (crossings, etc) were not announced anymore.
Autoskip behaviour was a mesh.My mood was pretty bad right now. So i switched from "All" to just "Via" for the announcements.
Everything was nice and silent around shaping points
I did get direction changes announcements again
Autoskip was pretty much back at a level as it should be.For me:
I don't want to touch the screen anymore after i start the route. The software needs to fix all the shit what comes along when i'm riding. No input from me what so ever should be needed. Just riding and follow the route as best a i can. The Software must do his job to make sure i can follow the original route as good a possible.I don't like Viapoints because you need to skip them manually when you missed one for what ever reason. But i like the functionality of it. So setting "Waypoint Messages" to "All" would be the solution for me. But this creates a lot of other shit.
MRA does have some work to do.
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@M-Schrijver said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
I don't like Viapoints because you need to skip them manually when you missed one for what ever reason. But i like the functionality of it. So setting "Waypoint Messages" to "All" would be the solution for me.
MRA does have some work to do.
… to skip them manually!
As mentioned I use Viapoints now for about twenty years on route planning and routing with Navigons and Garmins.
How often did this happen that you miss a fix Waypoint which you want to reach wether as a POI or as a checkpoint for routing, like I use it for too.
Usually 20 to 30 perhaps 35 Wp were always enough to plan long trips for a day to reach a destination, like a hotel or holiday flat, means distances to drive in a range of 450 to 600 kilometers on highways or overland roads. The same for day trips from the flat around with total length of 250 km. With a cabrio or any other car my experience is over years on trips through the country on narrow roads, passing villages at about every 6-10 kilometers, that you got an average speed of 50 kilometer per hour, perhaps but seldom 55. Consider, accept the speedlimit of max 100 in some countries 90 or even 80 only with a pocketfriedly deviation of 5 km or max. 10 on your speedometer.
May it is a special random effect, but up to now there was no holidayseason in France, Austria where I did not pass a laser speed control on countryside roads beside the mass of fix cameras there, which you did not find for the general limit 100 km/h in Germany.
So, a ride of 250 km is about 5-6 h in the saddle or behind the steering wheel. No coffee break, no lunch, no visit of anything you want.Garmin tells you with life traffic that you have to skip a waypoint.
On highways the use of fix wp (via) can be limited to a few, may after each change to another direction or highway number.
On country roads traffic jams are quite less (beside touristik hotspots with only one main road in or out, like e.g. Hallstadt or st. Tropez). Road constructions should be, but also how often and if so, a short stop and check is perhaps necessary at all. -
For me. Every point i need skip manually is 1 too many. Because i need stop to skip it properly.
Nearly all my routes i created are for myself. Which i ride with my wife and/or a few friends. Therefore i don't need to plan lunchstops etc. I stop when i see a nice spot. Usually every 1-1.5 hours. In the meantime i demand from my navigation software that it guides me, so i can drive the route as intended during planning.
When i take another direction for whatever reason. I expect from the software it brings me back to the original route without any nagging of complaining. Nothing more, nothing less. Every time again and again.
When the software is constant telling me i do something wrong. Then software is doing something wrong. It just need to shut up and guide me.I like to drive and i like to enjoy the scenery. Because of these 2 things i don't have the time and i don't want to fiddle with the navigation software when driving.
As you can see. I do not require a lot of features but the things i use needs to be 100% perfect in operation.Because The Netherlands is a pretty densed country with a lot of roads. A route over the backroads with a length of approx 250 km requires around 70 points to get a good reliable route which can be shared with others.
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@M-Schrijver
I am absolute with you!
Me too I plan tours only for myself and my wife but driving a car/cabrio. So pressing a button to skip a WP is easier.
What I wrote with stops for coffee or POI visiting could be by random for the coffee where ever we like or we need for the POI. But it was a sample too.
Fact is, WP for shaping or as POI are an option which you find in nearly every Navigation if not at all in every Navigation. Some have the option to select such WP as not mandatory WPs for shaping the route, most have only WPs as fix position need to reach. Manual skipping is necessary there.I am satisfied with the MRA option to have both SPs and fix WPs here POIs
And I wish that MRA works like you want
„I do not require a lot of features but the things i use needs to be 100% perfect in operation“And for my requests and things I could use or have on my Garmins MRA is at the moment not perfect.
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@Peter-Schiefer
Komme nochmal auf die Testrunde wo Ansage an WP5 ausbleibt.Heute ein anderes Verhalten.
Zuerst, am Fitness das iPhone eingeschaltet MRA App geöffnet während Sync 4 bootet und kabellos in den Carplay Modus geht. Was wan wie sich überschneidet, das weiß ich nun nicht. Fakt wie schon mal berichte blieb die Akkustik aus, keine Ansage zum kommenden Kreisverkehr, Abbiegen und WP. Ich bin bis zum Parkplatz unmittelbar hinter dem Abbiegen zu L170 und noch vor dem WP 4 gefahren. Auto aus, in der App Route gestoppt, App geschlossen.
Auto wieder an, gewartet bis alles gebootet, Carplay geht automatisch auf die zuletzt genutzte App also MRA und zeigt die Karte. Auf dem iPhone MRA geöffnet und es wird angeboten die nicht beendete Route fortzusetzen. Und was kam? Es wurde mir der WP5 als nächster Punkt voraus angekündigt, was sonst nicht funktioniert.
Nanu, Route beendet und statt dorthin gedreht und zurück bis hinter WP3. Dort Route neu gestartet mit nächstes Ziel WP3. Alles funktioniert bis WP4 und der Ansage in die L170 abzubiegen. Danach wie schon zuvor WP5 bis 7 werden nicht mehr angekündigt, nur noch das Ziel.
Was zum Teufel st das? Hoffe, ihr findet den Fehler. Wie schon erwähnt auf der Hinfahrt werden alle WPs wo gewollt auch angekündigt. -
Forgive me if I have not read all details above. I just want to handout some thoughts.
- Voice announcement for VIA points will take place 2000 mtrs before you reach it
- Voice announcement for SHAPING points will take place 750 mtrs before you reach it
- The above two rules ONLY apply when there are NO other shapingpoints within that distance. If there are, the announcement will take place AFTER passing that shaping point.
- Waypoint announcements take precedence over navigational instructions. Therefore it can happen that those are limited. This is especially the case in test scenarios where waypoints are usually closer than in normal scenic routes.
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@M-Schrijver said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
When i take another direction for whatever reason. I expect from the software it brings me back to the original route without any nagging of complaining. Nothing more, nothing less. Every time again and again.
The app cannot read minds. It does bring you back on the route. You can not choose to "disobey" and then blame the app for it. And it does not nag, but keeps giving you suggestions.
I do not require a lot of features but the things i use needs to be 100% perfect in operation.
That will not ever happen in a less than perfect world
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@Con-Hennekens said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
Forgive me if I have not read all details above. I just want to handout some thoughts.
- Voice announcement for VIA points will take place 2000 mtrs before you reach it
- Voice announcement for SHAPING points will take place 750 mtrs before you reach it
- The above two rules ONLY apply when there are NO other shapingpoints within that distance. If there are, the announcement will take place AFTER passing that shaping point.
- Waypoint announcements take precedence over navigational instructions. Therefore it can happen that those are limited. This is especially the case in test scenarios where waypoints are usually closer than in normal scenic routes.
Con
first thank you for some clarification, but my test results presents different things.
second my opinion (in conjuction with test ride)
A voice announcement vor a VIA Point 2000 m before set point on the road only once is absolute bad. To hit this point, perhaps a restaurant Parking entry you must look then all the time on the map to check the counter in the hand symbol which is by the way not visible in CarPlay. I concerned this now several times. Why do we not have a verbal countdown like for direction changes and the final destination.
This is the main reason I need my Garmin who do this.
A helper at the moment to avoid such early notice of a via is a shapingpoint about 500 earlier Text Vorankündigung Via. This works on my way to the gym and not on the way back after the turn right.That verbal text announcement of SP or Via could get in conflict with direction advices is clear and so set of such WP 300 to 500 m is necessary
In my sample gym to home the WP5 an SP will not be announced after WP4 a Via set at km 2.62, the turn right followed at 4.06 and WP 5 set at 4.93
On the tour to the gym is WP 4 a via at km 2,78, here the turn left follows at 3.84, a SP without text at 4,2, a. pre anouncement with SP at 5,66 a Via at 5.98 a SP „you reach destination“ at 7,58 a rigt turn at 7.82 a roundabout , correct noticed with second outlet at 7,98 and the gym as final destination at 8,04 km
CAN You please explain me now that on this route I got every verbal announcment as expected, even on these close gaps between WPs and driving instructions and on the tour back not.see my maps above, same streets same route forwars backward only WP sets are a bit different
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@Peter-Schiefer said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
A voice announcement vor a VIA Point 2000 m before set point on the road only once is absolute bad.
I agree with you that this is a rather long distance. The idea behind it is probably that especially VIA points are most important to be announced in due time, also at higher speeds. We do however have enough tools to limit that distance to a self chosen one, by placing a shaping point. in advance.
As to why in some circumstances it does not work like you expect, I really have no idea ;-). I have been testing this feature some time ago, and I must say it never let me down. Maybe some things have been tweaked in the meantime. I'll try and test again.
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@Con-Hennekens said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
@Peter-Schiefer said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
A voice announcement vor a VIA Point 2000 m before set point on the road only once is absolute bad.
I agree with you that this is a rather long distance. The idea behind it is probably that especially VIA points are most important to be announced in due time, also at higher speeds. We do however have enough tools to limit that distance to a self chosen one, by placing a shaping point. in advance.
Higher speed?
What do you mean with higher speed? A blade runer bike with up to 300km/h
Physics never lies. For 1000 meters with 100 kmh highest usal speed limit on countryside roads you need 36 seconds, with 120 km/h 30 seconds. So, for 2 km you have 1 minute and more to react on this announcement. This is real a to long time to have your eyes on the counter too while driving or at the CarPlay screen on this small hand icon when it get in depends to zoom factor. Me, I feel on countryside roads where even 100 km/h is a speed you can‘t drive is the first notification which Garmin does at 1,5 km quite to early. But you got repeating advices like MRA do at 1 km befor final destination.
So my proposal, this single early notification for POIs need improvment in distance to the target and add repeating contdown. -
i see that every person has it own idea about his way of planning and travel. i do understand all sides but that does not mean that it would fit in everybodies world of planning and travel. there will always pros and cons. peter is looking for his ideal cabrio software and maybe MRA will give him 90% of his wanted functionality. I hope he will use MRA and will be able to find solutions that work for him.
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@Con-Hennekens
The Via and SP announcements can interfer with direction announcements. If you know this. You can overcome this upto a certain level in the routeplanner.But.......
What happened at this moment. Because of this interference between Waypoint announcements and direction announcement. It causes that sometimes direction announcements will be gone for a longer period. Even when there are no waypoint announcements planned ahead. -
@Bouke-Ent said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
i see that every person has it own idea about his way of planning and travel. i do understand all sides but that does not mean that it would fit in everybodies world of planning and travel. there will always pros and cons. peter is looking for his ideal cabrio software and maybe MRA will give him 90% of his wanted functionality. I hope he will use MRA and will be able to find solutions that work for him.
Hallo Bouke-Ent
I believe, beside may track routing and very small roads, like some few mountain passes, graveled Military roads, the difference between bikers routing and cabrio drivers on lovely country roads is very small. I use and collect as source for my route planning a lot of propsal from certain biker magazines, may due to the lack of alternatives for Cabrios.
And also the variance on bikers preference is big. There are Harley riders and sportbike riders as well as riders of Enduros. The chance to see a Harley on a military gravel road, I believe is zero.Actually there are some issues with navigation only which I concern not alone.
Wondering me is over the last few weeks diving deeper in Navigation with MRA next and several test, that I am more or less alone with my concern that a POI on the route on which I like to stop is only announced once at 2 km bevor you there.
May the use of in-earphones on bikes or helmet phones is not so popular and they have the eyes more on the map.
The map respective the MRA main screen on the phones presents more informations than CarPlay or AA do. So the verbal info helps a lot. But Displays for bikes for CP and AA are increasing, cause of bigger size and better environmetal resistance on the handle bar than expensive smartphones.
In my opinion MRA has to look for improments regard this development.
But for this is a similarity with all Apps for routing with CP and AA connectivity.
There is an interesting comparison on YT by another cabrio driver
Falk, the everyday roadster. https://youtu.be/eY0_XTPamZk?si=0ho-tOKAR88wqJKb
He compared a lot of Apps, but up to now not MRA on which I informed him to do this perhaps next.
By his results and some own comparisons in my opinion MRA is furthermore my favorite. -
@Peter-Schiefer said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
So, for 2 km you have 1 minute and more to react on this announcement. This is real a to long time to have your eyes on the counter too while driving or at the CarPlay screen
Well, Information about "must-stops" (that's what VIA points are!) is VERY welcome in due time, and 1 minute is nothing too soon at all, since often you have to look out for a safe place to stop. Besides, you should not drive with your eyes on the counter.
It's your calculation, but I think it is pretty perfect as it is.
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@Con-Hennekens said in Noch keine Lösung und auch keine Antwort:
Well, Information about "must-stops" (that's what VIA points are!) is VERY welcome in due time, and 1 minute is nothing too soon at all, since often you have to look out for a safe place to stop. Besides, you should not drive with your eyes on the counter.
It's your calculation, but I think it is pretty perfect as it is.
Sorry Con,
since often you have to look for a safe place to stop
is a very weak argument for a single announcement 2 km before the POI.
And if so, why do we have for the final destination a 3 times announcement beginning at 1 km and the final voice you here is close at the POI including perhaps the side on the road.
Each POI with a real stop, which shall be a coffee stop, a lunch restaurant, a musuem, a meeting point with others for a ride has in my point of view, I was Quality Engineer working with FMEAs the same severity like the final stop. You need a parking spot for your vehicle or the vehicle of a group.
This is part of the planning for a route and I believe you check this too like me with e. g. Satellit view and Street view.
I was traveling throug Europe to a lot of supplying companies. Street view starting in 2010 was for me a big helper at my Office in Cologne to check the local conditions of companies and their gates for visitors before I travelled. Very often the mail drop was not the gate address..
So, don‘ t tell me you do not this before at the planing stage and beginn to seek for a parking on the road 2 km before the POI or the parking (entry) which you can mark in the map.Garmin announce each WP with alarm, equal to MRAs Hand POI, with a countdown until the end with „your POi is on the left or right“. Apple and Google do so too.
I expect that MRA add this in the near future too, consider give himself the lable to be the best Nav App.