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Quality of navigation

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved [Beta] Problems, Bugs and other Issues
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  • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Online
    Corjan Meijerinkundefined Online
    Corjan Meijerink
    Developer
    wrote on last edited by
    #9

    Wow! Thanks, this helps a lot 🙂

    It might be as simple then that our app always prefers shorter over faster. Or it might be way more complex 😉

    Regardless, thanks a lot for these details.

    Jure Sirena 0undefined 1 Reply Last reply
    -1
    • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Corjan Meijerink

      Wow! Thanks, this helps a lot 🙂

      It might be as simple then that our app always prefers shorter over faster. Or it might be way more complex 😉

      Regardless, thanks a lot for these details.

      Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
      Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
      Jure Sirena 0
      wrote on last edited by
      #10

      @Corjan-Meijerink Its defenetely a map problem - you can see it in route planner already - its because categorization of roads in openstreet map is shitty..... Same route, openstreetmaps just wont use highway, and ETA is significantly higheras per tomtom or even HERE maps (almost 2 hours). With this unfortunatelly to me the app is useless as navigation is useless...:(

      0f7b5180-8905-4268-906b-5d1c9dea3d19-image.png

      39f486aa-fb6e-4acc-a316-953bc26a3ec3-image.png

      15d3553b-83d8-477c-822a-5b2662d33560-image.png

      Tomtom is far superior here and trustworthy (using in paralele Tomtom Mobile GO and Tomtom rider 550 on the bike

      Herko ter Horstundefined 1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • Jure Sirena 0undefined Jure Sirena 0

        @Corjan-Meijerink Its defenetely a map problem - you can see it in route planner already - its because categorization of roads in openstreet map is shitty..... Same route, openstreetmaps just wont use highway, and ETA is significantly higheras per tomtom or even HERE maps (almost 2 hours). With this unfortunatelly to me the app is useless as navigation is useless...:(

        0f7b5180-8905-4268-906b-5d1c9dea3d19-image.png

        39f486aa-fb6e-4acc-a316-953bc26a3ec3-image.png

        15d3553b-83d8-477c-822a-5b2662d33560-image.png

        Tomtom is far superior here and trustworthy (using in paralele Tomtom Mobile GO and Tomtom rider 550 on the bike

        Herko ter Horstundefined Offline
        Herko ter Horstundefined Offline
        Herko ter Horst
        wrote on last edited by
        #11

        @Jure-Sirena-0 MRA Navigation (Next) uses HERE maps, not OSM, so what you're saying doesn't make sense.

        Jure Sirena 0undefined 1 Reply Last reply
        1
        • Herko ter Horstundefined Herko ter Horst

          @Jure-Sirena-0 MRA Navigation (Next) uses HERE maps, not OSM, so what you're saying doesn't make sense.

          Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
          Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
          Jure Sirena 0
          wrote on last edited by
          #12

          @Herko-ter-Horst Last picture in last post is Here maps:
          898km and 12h:35min
          tomtom is second picture
          915km and 10h:55min
          exactly same route, only changing maps in menu. On top of this MRA Next Beta application ALWAYS takes me off motorway through the back road - just like first picture with openstreetmaps does (app pic during navigation few pics higher), something is wrong....very wrong.

          Routing in MRA Next is same as in routeplanner with Openstreetmaps. While the most wrong thing is that it chooses it despite not being the fastest (when you decide not to take it, it recalculates and ETA drops signoificantly)

          1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
            Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
            Jure Sirena 0
            wrote on last edited by
            #13

            I have tested this weekend 3 other routes inland point to point A-B, no intermideatte waypoints, all cca 100km, MRA Next app took me (wanted to) all the time through back roads, through cities....and yes route planer is set to fastest on no curvines (you can see the signs beside each waypoint)

            Same route with tomtom faultless and always cca 20-25min faster (including potential traffic slow downs, which are amazingly accurate in tomtom)

            app is PERFECT when you exactly precise the route with your many waypoints, while navigation itself at the moment is lacking quality. Guys will look into it.

            Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • Jure Sirena 0undefined Jure Sirena 0

              I have tested this weekend 3 other routes inland point to point A-B, no intermideatte waypoints, all cca 100km, MRA Next app took me (wanted to) all the time through back roads, through cities....and yes route planer is set to fastest on no curvines (you can see the signs beside each waypoint)

              Same route with tomtom faultless and always cca 20-25min faster (including potential traffic slow downs, which are amazingly accurate in tomtom)

              app is PERFECT when you exactly precise the route with your many waypoints, while navigation itself at the moment is lacking quality. Guys will look into it.

              Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Offline
              Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Offline
              Hans van de Ven MR.MRA
              RouteXpert
              wrote on last edited by Hans van de Ven MR.MRA
              #14

              @Jure-Sirena-0
              Hello @Jure-Sirena-0

              I'm curious if you recreated the routes (with the 8 points and 898 KM) from scratch on every map?
              What options from the toolbox have you used in each map?

              I have made the following routes from scratch in every map.
              Only used 2 points and didn't use options from the toolbox.
              8271fc04-cb10-49e9-8fff-8b7bb522eea1-image.png

              OSM:
              0c151df5-36e1-4359-989f-1fa675cd635e-image.png

              TomTom:
              7d0a3416-9b82-4ece-8901-4b8dcb5402c5-image.png

              Here:
              2c0e1a59-40df-4363-b2ba-d86dd973c0f3-image.png

              Comparison of the 3 routes:
              OSM route opened, it has a black line.
              Here has the yellow line
              TomTom has the blue line
              Now you see that all 3 routes are generated differently on some parts.
              7f5bf326-37c7-4f4e-8354-333c65e8a57c-image.png

              Tom route opened, it has a black line.
              OSM has the yellow line
              Here has the blue line
              Now you see that all 3 routes are generated differently on some parts.
              f9d1dea9-53a4-425f-843f-b7943cbf69de-image.png

              Here route opened, it has a black line.
              OSM has the yellow line
              TomTom has the blue line
              Now you see that all 3 routes are generated differently on some parts.
              207db029-d693-4bd5-980d-d32fb052ff0c-image.png

              Conclusion, so it depends on which map you make a route.
              To use MRA Navigation (Next) it is best to plan your route in the Here map. With A to B routes (which you probably use) only in the app and therefore the Here map, you know for sure that you have the fastest route, because that's how the routing of the Here map is set.
              That the times and distances differ slightly per map can therefore be explained. Because each card has its own routing settings.

              Garmin Zumo XT2/XT/BMW Connected Ride Navigator/MyRouteapp (The App)
              Een dag niet gelachen is een dag niet geleefd / Een route is net zo goed als deze uitgezet is.

              Jure Sirena 0undefined 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Hans van de Ven MR.MRA

                @Jure-Sirena-0
                Hello @Jure-Sirena-0

                I'm curious if you recreated the routes (with the 8 points and 898 KM) from scratch on every map?
                What options from the toolbox have you used in each map?

                I have made the following routes from scratch in every map.
                Only used 2 points and didn't use options from the toolbox.
                8271fc04-cb10-49e9-8fff-8b7bb522eea1-image.png

                OSM:
                0c151df5-36e1-4359-989f-1fa675cd635e-image.png

                TomTom:
                7d0a3416-9b82-4ece-8901-4b8dcb5402c5-image.png

                Here:
                2c0e1a59-40df-4363-b2ba-d86dd973c0f3-image.png

                Comparison of the 3 routes:
                OSM route opened, it has a black line.
                Here has the yellow line
                TomTom has the blue line
                Now you see that all 3 routes are generated differently on some parts.
                7f5bf326-37c7-4f4e-8354-333c65e8a57c-image.png

                Tom route opened, it has a black line.
                OSM has the yellow line
                Here has the blue line
                Now you see that all 3 routes are generated differently on some parts.
                f9d1dea9-53a4-425f-843f-b7943cbf69de-image.png

                Here route opened, it has a black line.
                OSM has the yellow line
                TomTom has the blue line
                Now you see that all 3 routes are generated differently on some parts.
                207db029-d693-4bd5-980d-d32fb052ff0c-image.png

                Conclusion, so it depends on which map you make a route.
                To use MRA Navigation (Next) it is best to plan your route in the Here map. With A to B routes (which you probably use) only in the app and therefore the Here map, you know for sure that you have the fastest route, because that's how the routing of the Here map is set.
                That the times and distances differ slightly per map can therefore be explained. Because each card has its own routing settings.

                Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                Jure Sirena 0
                wrote on last edited by Jure Sirena 0
                #15

                @Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master its what I am saying all the time, I know app uses Here maps, but the problem is that its navigatiing with big big errors - not taking / using the highways, taking you backroads etc, despite having used no special toolbox. I have settings to fastest and 0 curvines.

                It happened again today - from A to B:
                Same exact point but MRA Next map wanted to go right through the city, while tomtom took the most sensable way straight to Ljubljana ringroad. This are my everyday routes and I know you need to be crazy not to take ring road (no tool roads by the way on it) so MRA takes the crazy option througj the city.
                In circles - it seems that MRA next ALWAYS takes the shortest option no matter what you choose.

                By taking shortest option you know what it happens. The app took me twice to strange roads and then I started to compare

                BTW: Look closely to your test routes, tomtom is 1h faster on more km (!!) because it AVOIDS cities like essen, HERE takes you throuh city
                This is my point, and if you will while driving choose to go where tomtom is navigationg you ETa in MRA will immediatelly drop by 10-20min! So I am absolutely 100% sure it is not navigating via FASTEST option1.jpg 2.jpg

                1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                  Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                  Jure Sirena 0
                  wrote on last edited by Jure Sirena 0
                  #16

                  Todays case from route planner:

                  Here maps - as per MRA Next:
                  ee0e459c-68c0-46cc-bd42-f81bf0d95a60-image.png

                  Tomtom (Tomtom mobile GO on phone choosed same option):
                  c3837e61-bd19-4d6a-abae-e807d50b5dd2-image.png

                  Secomd option is FAR FAR prefered, and FAR FAR fastest, its a ring road obviously.

                  First option through the center of city, also dictated by MRA app, second via ring road dicated by Tomtom. I refused to go via MRA, and when I reached ring road MRA recalculated and went where I wanted to go, and its ETA dropped by 14 min!

                  So my only point: MRA Next does not navigate via optimal route UNLESS you cleary set your waypoints where you want to go

                  In my car I can use phone for MRA app and Carplay for Tom tom simultaniously, when taking print screen it takes screen of both simultaniously

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                    Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                    Jure Sirena 0
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #17

                    I can continue, I am planing big motorcycle trip in Tunisia in Feb 2023:

                    Same route, despite the fact that I set many many waypoints on path where I want to go:

                    649f43db-a2f7-4c2c-9c38-89be8b496562-image.png
                    3c257aea-81d7-44fb-9e0c-887893b005e7-image.png
                    Tomtom is 2 hours (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) faster despite more km

                    I am a motorcycle guide who travels cca 30-40.000km per year and I have real faith in tomtom navigation. I realyl like the MRA app because of features, especially regarding waypoints and segments, but navigation is not serious 😞

                    To be clear - I am not blaming the app, but I do think reason is in map database, app is only using the info embeded in the maps (categorization of roads, positioning, etc etc) So I guess, having a serious navigation requires serious map database....

                    Segments like this make a difference - green is HERE maps, imagin going through center of busy tunis cities....
                    0389c8fc-0dc2-4626-95a7-666d7e904d22-image.png

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                      Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                      Jure Sirena 0
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #18

                      When you say
                      To use MRA Navigation (Next) it is best to plan your route in the Here map. With A to B routes (which you probably use) only in the app and therefore the Here map, you know for sure that you have the fastest route, because that's how the routing of the Here map is set.

                      Everything in practice shows this is not true, it seems MRA N always chooses shortest route

                      Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • Jure Sirena 0undefined Jure Sirena 0

                        When you say
                        To use MRA Navigation (Next) it is best to plan your route in the Here map. With A to B routes (which you probably use) only in the app and therefore the Here map, you know for sure that you have the fastest route, because that's how the routing of the Here map is set.

                        Everything in practice shows this is not true, it seems MRA N always chooses shortest route

                        Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Offline
                        Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Offline
                        Hans van de Ven MR.MRA
                        RouteXpert
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #19

                        @Jure-Sirena-0

                        @Jure-Sirena-0 Thanks for your input, MRA Navigation (Next) is still in the development phase, so things will definitely improve

                        Garmin Zumo XT2/XT/BMW Connected Ride Navigator/MyRouteapp (The App)
                        Een dag niet gelachen is een dag niet geleefd / Een route is net zo goed als deze uitgezet is.

                        Jure Sirena 0undefined 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Hans van de Ven MR.MRA

                          @Jure-Sirena-0

                          @Jure-Sirena-0 Thanks for your input, MRA Navigation (Next) is still in the development phase, so things will definitely improve

                          Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                          Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                          Jure Sirena 0
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #20

                          @Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master
                          Keep it up!

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Online
                            Corjan Meijerinkundefined Online
                            Corjan Meijerink
                            Developer
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #21

                            A quick follow up here: by default the toll road are disabled. This means that the app will not use them if an alternative is possible.

                            In a next update (not the upcoming) more routing preferences will be added 😃

                            Tumbleweedundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                            1
                            • Corjan Meijerinkundefined Corjan Meijerink

                              A quick follow up here: by default the toll road are disabled. This means that the app will not use them if an alternative is possible.

                              In a next update (not the upcoming) more routing preferences will be added 😃

                              Tumbleweedundefined Offline
                              Tumbleweedundefined Offline
                              Tumbleweed
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #22

                              @Corjan-Meijerink
                              When I use the app to make a route somewhere I want to go in Canada it uses Toll roads before non toll on the route it makes. I hate this, I should be able to pick no tolls, dirt roads, etc.

                              Corjan Meijerinkundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • Tumbleweedundefined Tumbleweed

                                @Corjan-Meijerink
                                When I use the app to make a route somewhere I want to go in Canada it uses Toll roads before non toll on the route it makes. I hate this, I should be able to pick no tolls, dirt roads, etc.

                                Corjan Meijerinkundefined Online
                                Corjan Meijerinkundefined Online
                                Corjan Meijerink
                                Developer
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #23

                                @Tumbleweed Yes, I completely understand. Therefore we are implementing it in another iteration 😉 No worries! It's still a Beta app and we need to prioritise what features we pick first.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                1
                                • Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                                  Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                                  Jure Sirena 0
                                  wrote on last edited by Jure Sirena 0
                                  #24

                                  I prepared the routes for Tunisia, but I must say to my dissapointment I cannot use the app - and main reason is HERE maps.....from begining of this post I suspected the reason for bad navigation is in the HERE maps.

                                  1.case (same route just changing maps)
                                  When I create route, it takes me FAR FAR around between waypoint 10-11, because lots of MAIN roads are missing: HERE MAPS
                                  faf1fde9-40d8-4433-b04f-ca919a51cf15-image.png

                                  Tomtom maps (more then 3h less)
                                  64d2c9f8-09c4-4dff-91c4-89208b380348-image.png

                                  Openstreet maps
                                  e022d76c-4ef1-49ce-9268-b2afc98f0c5e-image.png

                                  Comparing route on both maps
                                  e16c159c-9dff-4b94-bbe3-1a971e22b827-image.png

                                  1. case
                                    Here maps is green, you can also see that it wants to take me straight through Sahara desert sand to waypoint 15....skipping points 12,13,14??

                                  3.case
                                  Between point 8 and 9 takes road that is not driveable...etc

                                  1. case
                                    from point 3 it takes unexisting road again

                                  Since the MRA usas the wors map option - HERE I cant use the app on my trip....
                                  And I noticed lots of this map errors driving in central Europe.
                                  Time to invest in maps guys....

                                  Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • Jure Sirena 0undefined Jure Sirena 0

                                    I prepared the routes for Tunisia, but I must say to my dissapointment I cannot use the app - and main reason is HERE maps.....from begining of this post I suspected the reason for bad navigation is in the HERE maps.

                                    1.case (same route just changing maps)
                                    When I create route, it takes me FAR FAR around between waypoint 10-11, because lots of MAIN roads are missing: HERE MAPS
                                    faf1fde9-40d8-4433-b04f-ca919a51cf15-image.png

                                    Tomtom maps (more then 3h less)
                                    64d2c9f8-09c4-4dff-91c4-89208b380348-image.png

                                    Openstreet maps
                                    e022d76c-4ef1-49ce-9268-b2afc98f0c5e-image.png

                                    Comparing route on both maps
                                    e16c159c-9dff-4b94-bbe3-1a971e22b827-image.png

                                    1. case
                                      Here maps is green, you can also see that it wants to take me straight through Sahara desert sand to waypoint 15....skipping points 12,13,14??

                                    3.case
                                    Between point 8 and 9 takes road that is not driveable...etc

                                    1. case
                                      from point 3 it takes unexisting road again

                                    Since the MRA usas the wors map option - HERE I cant use the app on my trip....
                                    And I noticed lots of this map errors driving in central Europe.
                                    Time to invest in maps guys....

                                    Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Offline
                                    Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Offline
                                    Hans van de Ven MR.MRA
                                    RouteXpert
                                    wrote on last edited by Hans van de Ven MR.MRA
                                    #25

                                    @Jure-Sirena-0

                                    Just zoom in and place some extra shaping points
                                    The here map is good for navigating, or is it due to the route taken?

                                    cff7966b-53ed-49f1-a8e1-3ffd43286936-image.png

                                    Garmin Zumo XT2/XT/BMW Connected Ride Navigator/MyRouteapp (The App)
                                    Een dag niet gelachen is een dag niet geleefd / Een route is net zo goed als deze uitgezet is.

                                    Jure Sirena 0undefined 1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined Hans van de Ven MR.MRA

                                      @Jure-Sirena-0

                                      Just zoom in and place some extra shaping points
                                      The here map is good for navigating, or is it due to the route taken?

                                      cff7966b-53ed-49f1-a8e1-3ffd43286936-image.png

                                      Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                                      Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                                      Jure Sirena 0
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #26

                                      @Hans-van-de-Ven-MRA-Master said in Quality of navigation:

                                      @Jure-Sirena-0

                                      Just zoom in and place some extra shaping points
                                      The here map is good for navigating, or is it due to the route taken?

                                      cff7966b-53ed-49f1-a8e1-3ffd43286936-image.png

                                      What is the point if the user has to make route and not the tool? Will I always need to g oto other tools to see roads and manually create points for every wrong paths in routes? Sorry it does not work like that especially on not known terriotries.
                                      Thats my original point - qiality of navigation.

                                      Hans van de Ven MR.MRAundefined 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                                        Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                                        Jure Sirena 0
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #27

                                        Of course it was HERE and no tool kits activated

                                        2d8e48b2-dedb-4738-9542-71bce41f6367-image.png

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                                          Jure Sirena 0undefined Offline
                                          Jure Sirena 0
                                          wrote on last edited by Jure Sirena 0
                                          #28

                                          And the next stupid thing is - when I implement what you suggest time falls significantly. This way user is more smart then the tool. Tthe tool should do that!!

                                          It was 13h2m at original route
                                          edb8befb-a64d-44af-bd25-85c77ebc7b5a-image.png

                                          then time (and distance) drops for 30 min when i add points 11 and 17 to tell the tool that its giving me wrong direction....

                                          a5e5339e-585c-462f-a8e8-4853221a9245-image.png

                                          This should net be happening, I loose complete faith in navigation 😞

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